Thread: Ken Livingstone suspended by Labour Party in 'anti-Semitism' row

Originally Posted by sabang

And the Muslim will still win the London election,

If i had a vote it would go to Sidiq Khan.

watched Zac on tv and he was going on about his jaunts in Bombay
how marvelous and exciting and colourful Bollywood was and that he was a big fan of it.
So who is your favourite Bollywood star Zac asked the reporter

err err err let me think,,,, a bit more struggle to think of one name
and then he gave up,,, i don't know.
and his election smile was gone.

Critism?

Why the Labour Party Won't Confront British Muslim anti-Semitism
Too many Labour politicians cravenly adopted the anti-Semitic tropes and anti-Israel demonization they think will get them British Muslim votes, rather than standing up to the prejudice that exists in the community.

Ruth Deech May 04, 2016 3:17 PM

Anti-Semitism is the Labour Party's Real Problem, Not its Leader

British Labour Party scandal illustrates Zionism's main problem
Anglo-Jewry is suffering from ennui. What is new to the general media[at]is not at all news for us. For 20 years or so anti-Semitism has been growing in the U.K., on the Left.

Yes, there are right-wing anti-Semites and there are Holocaust deniers, but they have for long been treated as buffoons of no importance,]which is true, and being of the "Right" they are not taken seriously, whereas to be of the "Left" is to be righteous, sanctimonious and beyond criticism or reproof.

The current British focus on anti-Semitism is welcome, even if rather late in the day. It has been nurtured in the columns of the U.K.’s Independent and Guardian newspapers for years, and obsessed over in the London Review of Books. Esteemed Labour MPs Luciana Berger and Louise Ellman have been consistently and viciously trolled by anti-Semites.

Ken Livingstone, the former Mayor of London, and MP Naz Shah, were suspended recently over their remarks about Zionism. Three Labour councilors have been suspended for comparisons between Israel and Hitler, for stating that Israel funds ISIS and for calling for the "relocation" of Israelis. The U.K. Telegraph reported this week that over 50 Labour members had been secretly suspended over the last two months for anti-Semitic remarks.

In Livingstone's case it was a comment that Hitler supported Zionism "before he went mad" (it’s curious how many anti-Zionists cannot refrain from bringing Hitler and Nazism into every discussion, as a way of coloring perceptions of Israel).

Naz Shah retweeted a map suggesting that relocation of Israel’s Jews to the U.S., originally posted by Jewish Jew-hater Norman Finkelstein.

Therein lies a further problem. Facebook and Twitter are awash with posts to the effect that if a Jew can post such a map, then she who re-tweets it cannot be anti-Semitic.

That in itself is an anti-Semitic conclusion, one that collapses the ability to call out anti-Semitic comments by virtue of its ‘Jewish’ imprimatur. If one black person were to defend slavery would that make it acceptable? Would that person immediately be perceived as the spokesperson for all black people? Of course not.

It is only when some renegade Jews can be found to attack Zionism and Jewish history that they become the representative Jewish voice.

Gerald Kaufman, Norman Finkelstein, Avi Shlaim, Noam Chomsky, Ilan Pappe, Gilad Atzmon too many, regrettably, with their own reasons for what they say.

What is erroneous about the current exploration of anti-Semitism in the Labour party is the way the bigotry is taken at face value, and no further investigation of its causes and roots are suggested.

Those who speak so virulently against Israel and the Jews must be anti-Semitic, it is concluded, and need re-education, as if they emerged from a vacuum.

Well, yes, but they are also politicians, and politicians seek votes. Naz Shah, George Galloway, her predecessor as MP, and David Ward, a former Lib-Dem MP who was suspended from his party for calling for the end of Israel, all represented Bradford.

The U.K. census of 2011 revealed that Bradford's population was 24.7% Muslim, and no doubt it’s higher by now.

There are wards of Bradford, Blackburn and Burnley (the suspended councilors' constituencies) where British Muslims reach 70% of the local population. David Ward's successor as MP, Imran Hussain, has also gone out of his way to criticize Israel.

All of these politicians adopted language and ideas that certainly aren’t even as subtle as a "dog whistle". They are playing to what they believe to be their Muslim voters' prejudices.

A recent Channel 4 TV survey of the attitudes of British Muslims found inter alia that 26% of the U.K. Muslim community believed Jews were responsible for the majority of the world's conflicts, and that 40% of those surveyed believed that U.K. Jews were more loyal to Israel than to Britain.

In a devastating and now even more timely 2013 article in the New Statesman entitled “The sorry truth is that the virus of anti-Semitism has infected the British Muslim community”, Mehdi Hasan, a British Muslim political journalist, stated that "It’s a shameful fact that Muslims are not only the victims of racial and religious prejudice but purveyors of it, too…Anti-Semitism isn't just tolerated in some sections of the British Muslim community; it's routine and commonplace."

Politicians who court thousands of voters who may possibly believe this rubbish are now feeling the need to pander to them, rather than think for themselves and stand up against prejudice.

That is the real tragedy of this current exposé of anti-Semitism on the Left. Anti-Israel demonization, they think, will get those votes. Fear of violence in Britain and the belief that by appeasing their Muslim voters they will secure themselves in power are the driver behind these abhorrent statements.

So the condemnations of anti-Semitism that we hear from Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn and the offenders typically express disapproval of anti-Semitism, Islamophobia and all forms of racism, lest anyone think that anti-Semitism was special, or had any roots in the religion and culture of Islam.

From the Left has emerged BDS boycott, divestment and sanctions the program of the destruction of the only Jewish state, with its 6 million Jews conveniently gathered together; and the resurrection of the anti-Semitic attitudes of the 19th and early 20th century, but this time directed towards the Jewish state rather than the Jews: Nazism, genocide, conspiracy, blood libels, organ stealing, child killing.

The far Left has married up with the widespread Muslim dislike of Israel, and with the remnants on the Right who hold historic anti-Semitic views, more racially and religiously based.

So we have a failure of education, a craven attitude towards the supposed beliefs of Muslim voters (set to worsen as migration increases), a foreign policy toward Israel dictated by fear and hatred, and a Labour party leader who has shown himself unable to analyse this and take a stand against it.

Corbyn's very presence has opened up a channel for the expression of these deluded views. He is the man who has consorted with Hamas and Hezbollah; he defended Stephen Sizer, a vicar who blamed 9/11 on Jews; he has associated with Paul Eisen, Holocaust denier, and so on.

I have little faith in the inquiry that the Labour Party has announced into "anti-Semitism and other forms of racism", the remit itself already makes evident that its focus will be watered down and the blame largely dissipated.


(Baroness Ruth Deech is an independent peer in the House of Lords. A lawyer, she was formerly Principal of St Anne's College Oxford, a governor of the BBC, chair of the Human Fertilisation & Embryology Authority and a trustee of the Rhodes) Scholarships. Twitter: @BaronessDeech
read more: Why the Labour Party Won't Confront British Muslim anti-Semitism - Opinion - Haaretz - Israel News Haaretz.com

Originally Posted by ENT

Ruth Deech May 04, 2016 3:17 PM

Deech was placed at no.26 in Channel 4's "The God List", which ranked "the fifty people of faith in Britain who exercise the most power and influence over our lives"

Joan Bakewell talks to Baroness Ruth Deech, who has spent most of her career in public service and is arguably best known for her work as chair of the Human Fertility and Embryology Authority. She talks to Joan about her upbringing in a Jewish household in south London and what impact this had on some decisions she has had to make during her time at the HFEA.

So - to qualify this bullshit opinion piece. She is a the 26th most powerful religios person in the UK - and Jewish.

She was a member of the Jewish Leadership Council until 2010, was a Rhodes Trustee 1996-2006, and a founding Trustee of The Mandela Rhodes Foundation.

She was high up in an israeli lobby organisation who tries to push the UK democratic political process to support another country even if that goes against the interests of the UK

She is deeply committed to the Rhodes mob, which uses Cecil Rhodes money and legacy to push for their eugenics dream, a white master race, and a man who is paired with Arthur Balfour in terms of their Zionist ambitions. Note Clinton was a Rhodes Scholar.

So... with all this in mind, do you perhaps think that this zionist eugenicist, who worked all her life within Human Fertility and Embryology(!!!!!!!!!!!!) might have some sort of agenda in her writing?

I don't live in the sandpit. Troll?

Ahh, yes, the definition of a troll seems to be these days

Individual who posts irrefutable devastating factual evidence and information that derails the blabbering of racist imbeciles who prefer to rely on pro israel made up history and propaganda.

Yes - best you call up the Oxford English dictionary crowd and let them know.

Originally Posted by pseudolus

I don't live in the sandpit.

I think he dresses in tin foil fatigues and lives in a fortified basement protected by the most advanced mossad detection technology available.

Originally Posted by taxexile

Originally Posted by pseudolus

I don't live in the sandpit.

I think he dresses in tin foil fatigues and lives in a fortified basement protected by the most advanced mossad detection technology available.

Why would you say that? Because I check your sources and find them to be the works of right wing israeli fascists?

Yeah a real conspiracy theorist I am.

Just keep your head down and the door locked, and you'll be fine.

Originally Posted by taxexile

Just keep your head down and the door locked, and you'll be fine.

think you should be more worried, somchai wannabee that you are, as you think there are 1,600,000,000 muslim suicide bombers out to get you.

How many Palestinian's been killed, injured, and brutalised today I wonder- by Trespassers on their own land?

And Ii think to myself, what a wonderful world.

Well, democratic model country israel has arrested 10 journalists today, 6 of them without charges. Gonna hold them for 4 months without trial because they are a good nice friendly people. They are the victim of course.

Couple of days ago a settler was sentenced to 20 yrs in prison after he and some settler friendly type kidnapped and Burnt a Palestinian Child to death

2 IDF shootings of civilians today, and a very suspect explosion in Gaza. Suspect because it claimed the life of someone, and the israeli media had that persons picture and information on the TV whilst the explosion sound was still ricocheting around Gaza. I want t point out that the IDF are brave, and the victim, and israel is the victim as well.

A Palestinian view on the antisemitism row

Lord Balfour, who in 1917 promised British government support for ‘the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people’. Photograph: Hulton Getty

Jonathan Freedland (My plea to the left, 30 April) asks us to imagine if a country far away was created for black people and asks if the left would treat it as it does Israel. As a Palestinian I want to tell him that if, instead of a country for Jews, a country for black people or any other group had been created in our homeland without our consent, we would have objected and resisted as Palestinians with the same vigour.

If it continued to defy international law and occupy, colonise and murder and make our lives so miserable that we would leave, we would call for its boycott as we do in the case of the real occupier, Israel. And if that occupation had continued for as long as Israel’s has, we would have called supporters of human rights to help us end this occupation, treat Palestinian citizens of that state equally and allow Palestinian refugees to return. As it happens, those are the legitimate demands of the BDS movement called by Palestinian civil society organisations in 2005.

Further, had Israel been created in, say, Uganda and not in Palestine, does Freedland or any other supporter of Israel think that Palestinians would have created Fatah or Hamas and sent them to Uganda to attack the Jewish citizens of this entity in Uganda?

Even closer to home, Balfour had more right to promise Wales to the Zionists than Palestine – with my apologies to the Welsh people. Had he done so and had Israel been created in Wales, had Cardiff been occupied and declared the united capital of Israel, and had Swansea been under siege for 10 years because it reacted to Israel’s illegal occupation, would the Welsh have simply accepted this and behaved as a model occupied people?

I remind all who are interested in peace in historic Palestine that we Palestinians did not choose our occupiers. They chose Palestine knowing it was not an empty land but one that had a people, my people, the Palestinians that have paid with their land, lives and rights.

As we approach the 68th anniversary of our catastrophe or Nakba, our occupiers need to acknowledge the wrong they did to us, apologise and pursue a genuine reconciliation, which may necessitate a very different political arrangement in historic Palestine. Instead they are busy conflating antisemitism with anti-Zionism, thinking this will end the call for Israel to come to its senses. Supporters of Israel who do this are really working to protect its illegal policies and to delay the day when it finally operates within rather than above the law.
Professor Kamel Hawwash

Originally Posted by pseudolus

Even closer to home, Balfour had more right to promise Wales to the Zionists than Palestine – with my apologies to the Welsh people.

Leave the Welsh out of it ,you bastard ! Only four Jewish families in my town and I was friends with all of them. We didn't have any Arabs and only one black man. He sold newspapers outside the Castle cinema. Not surprisingly, he was known as "Harry the Black". Nothing racist about that term as my friends, Dai Decimal, Dai the Gas, Tom the Milk, Dai Stallion, Dicky Worm and Dai Bakehouse will testify.

Originally Posted by can123

Originally Posted by pseudolus

Even closer to home, Balfour had more right to promise Wales to the Zionists than Palestine – with my apologies to the Welsh people.

Leave the Welsh out of it ,you bastard ! Only four Jewish families in my town and I was friends with all of them. We didn't have any Arabs and only one black man. He sold newspapers outside the Castle cinema. Not surprisingly, he was known as "Harry the Black". Nothing racist about that term as my friends, Dai Decimal, Dai the Gas, Tom the Milk, Dai Stallion, Dicky Worm and Dai Bakehouse will testify.

Reminds me of that joke....A man goes into a pub in a small town and, for whatever reason, gets introduced to the clientele. There’s Farmer Jack, Barman Jim, Maurice “Dancer” and Sheepshagger John. After a few pints, the visitor’s curiosity gets the better of him and he asks John what’s with the nickname.

“See this pub?” asks John, "I built it, but they don’t call me Pubbuilder John? I’m the local doctor, I saved Barman Jim’s life once when he choked on a peanut, but they don’t call me Lifesaver John. Every year, I supply a huge Christmas tree for the village green, but the don’t call me Christmas Tree John.

“But you shag one lousy sheep…”

Bet you wouldn't be so happy though if Balfouor had given Cardiff to the zionists, who launched 60 year plus genocidal terror campaign against the Welsh.....

Originally Posted by pseudolus

Bet you wouldn't be so happy though if Balfouor had given Cardiff to the zionists, who launched 60 year plus genocidal terror campaign against the Welsh...

If such a thing had happened there would only be one outcome and it would not be in favour of the Jews. The Celts have different standards to the Arabs and would have sorted things immediately. Balfour would have been aware of this and that's why it never happened.

Originally Posted by can123

Originally Posted by pseudolus

Bet you wouldn't be so happy though if Balfouor had given Cardiff to the zionists, who launched 60 year plus genocidal terror campaign against the Welsh...

If such a thing had happened there would only be one outcome and it would not be in favour of the Jews. The Celts have different standards to the Arabs and would have sorted things immediately. Balfour would have been aware of this and that's why it never happened.

Even with England, USA, France funneling money and weapons to them?

Don't step on my blue suede shoes,, dude. Col. Parker.

Originally Posted by ENT

It’s a shameful fact that Muslims are not only the victims of racial and religious prejudice but purveyors of it, too

Does it not occur to the author that the two go hand in hand?
Much the same as the truism if you want to radicalise a people, brutalise them.

Well the tory smear campaign seems to have worked. The tory scum were on track for an absolute beating in the polls following their pledge to give all schools to their rich criminal mates. But, one call to the israel lobby later, and they managed to keep treading water.

Wonder how quickly the media will drop all of this?

I went on the BBC I player and watched the Mayors debate, that Lib Dem woman was nuts, she was a career politician, then the Green Party woman was dim, and as for that Jew boys performance, it was 3rd rate, only candidate that stood out was Kahn.
Good to go back and watch things before the winner was known.

Why British Jews Voted for Sadiq Khan Through Gritted Teeth - Opinion - Haaretz - Israel News Haaretz.com

Operation Protective Edge in 2014 was a turning point. The large number of Palestinian civilian casualties blotted out any rational explanation of the conflict. It was accentuated by instant and blanket media coverage in Britain and became a cause célèbre on the Left. The election of Corbyn last year was a psychological green light to what had been bubbling up below to overflow publicly. Social media acted as a loudspeaker. Ken Livingstone’s outburst, reminiscent of the mutterings of the white working-class far-right, was the spark that ignited the fire – and persuaded many Jewish Labour supporters to think twice about voting for Sadiq Khan.
read more: Why British Jews Voted for Sadiq Khan Through Gritted Teeth - Opinion - Haaretz - Israel News Haaretz.com

This is what this boils down to. This is why the antisemitism card was played, and they still are going to push it.

Israel has been bombing Gaza for 5 days now, only just relenting a little today.

The israeli lobby want rid of Corbyn so that when they launch their next genocidal attack against the civilian population within the concentration camp that is Gaza, there is no voice leading a major political party who will condemn them.

This has nothing to do with antisemitism. It has everything to do with getting a green light to continue the ethnic cleansing of Palestine which is given by the blairite labour scum, the tories, obomba, hillary and trump.

Luckily, and unfortunately for the israeli lobby, more and more people are seeing through them, and voices like herman, ent, piwaCile etc are the rarities now and are seen for what they are - right wing racist nutcases, no different to the mad mullahs.