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machangezi

^ BTW Tex, you didn't care to comment on the CIA part. Should I consider your silence as

1. You agree (which is not likely)

2. You don't give a toss because it is true and hurts your ego

3. Am I wrong (which is not likely)

Please share you inside info after all you were in the navy.

__________________
"The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact, non-Westerners never do." Samuel P. Huntington


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Texpat

^^ Doesn't bother me, Macha. But I doubt you'll change Blackgang's mind.

^ How about: I don't know. I haven't read anything about it or heard that elsewhere. Maybe. But I'm dubious of claims of covert CIA operations -- especially when, as a small- to medium-sized organization, they overthrow entire governments.

Maybe Clancy can write a book about it.

flash

Typical American way, do as we say not as we do............

machangezi

I don't want to change his mind. He can live hating and generalizing people, that is his choice and he is entitled to it.

Regarding his fucked up thread, which he started just to run his mouth, I think people of Iran also want a change but they don't see America and the west as a solution but a problem. Stoning to death is barbaric and I being a Muslim openly condemn it. I literally wrote to the president of Iran Ahmedinenutjobs on his official web site( President News ) showing my opposition to this barbaric act and I have openly condemned it on this forum. I don't know what else to do. I feel sorry for them for being punished like that.

Jet Gorgon

Gimme a gun. I'll shoot 'em.

lysander

And why shouldn't they? It was the UK & the US who instituted the coup d'etat which got rid of the democratically elected Mosaddeq and replaced him with the vile dictator Pahlevi.

One thing that the US (and this isn't an anti-US post) don't seem to understand is that the population of countries like Iran (Persia) draw on their history for sustenance. The Medes and Persians ruled one of the first world empires in history - 2500 years ago. They regard the US as the new kid on the block - powerful but unproven.

sabang

Absolutely- it is quite glaringly obvious reading threads like this how manipulable so many peoples attitudes are. Just put it in print, quoting a government official, and yesterdays friend is todays enemy- therefore of course his society is now evil and oppressive.

Sad to remember how Iraqi women (beauties) used to wear mini skirts to university, and 47% of the Doctors were women. Oh sorry, I forgot. That was under the brutal regime of Satan Hussein. Now they enjoy freedom and democracy- but unfortunately the doctors have fled.

And our great mates the Taliban, brave mujahideen fighting the evil Soviet empire- how could we not shower guns and money on them? The fact that the Soviet army was invited into Ghan by the recognised government of the day to help fight a growing Islamic insurgency from the south, well thats bullshit- because we now declare the government illegitimate! Yep, we had our way and put the brave Taliban in to power- a victory for Freedom! Whoops, Apocalypse. Now they are baddies, the epitome of Evil. They musta done got some bad religion overnight, or something.

Stick a fork in their ass Rupert, and flip 'em over. They're done.

__________________
To err is human. To blame someone else is politics.

Norton

Bad religion was not the issue. Their "religious" practices were tolerated for many years with nothing more than "condemnation" from the international community.

Refusing to cut their association with AQ/OBL was the trigger that put the Taliban out of favor and in turn resulted in their removal from power in Afganistan.

__________________
Eat right, exercise daily, live clean, die anyway.

pickel

More likely refusing to go with the Americans on the pipeline got them removed.

Norton

Some of that maybe but unlikely the US and the UK would have been able to get the UN Security Council to cooperate in the invasion of Afghanistan had the pipeline been a major factor.

Panda

Todays good guys are tomorrows bad guys and visa versa, depending on the political climate and financial interests of the western powers.

While I don't believe it is the duty of the western media to be the political watchdogs for society (thats the oppositions job), I do believe the western media in general could be a little bit more objective in reporting the facts rather than just becoming the mouthpieces of the political powers with dishonest agendas.

sabang

Plain fact is Norty, the Taliban was as bad when we helped put them into power as when we put them out (although they still control half the country). And the all new government we've installed is utterly useless, and well known to be up to it's neck in drug money. Ditto the 'Northern alliance', which shared power for a while.

Looking back, the only government that Afghanistan has had in the past 25 years that could be objectively described as legitimate was the one we helped put out of power, for the crime of inviting Russian forces in to help them fight a growing, and violent, civil insurgency emanating from some Fundamental Islamic Tribes in the southern Kandahar region. We never bothered asking for UN Security Council approval for that. I remember reading glowing praise for a certain Osama bin Laden, educated son of a wealthy family, who had put his life of privilege to one side to combat the Soviet menace.

How the World turns.

Loy Toy

I sincerely feel the press in general, and when they report on any topic lean towards the sensational. Lets sell some newspaers and air time and you can't blame them or the editors for trying to run a business.

Enough information about these OP issues has been tabled and at the end of the day the press are our (The General Public) political watchdogs whether we like it or not. At least we get a little bit of colourful truth now and then.

Norton

No argument from me on this. The Taliban and AQ need each other and they continue to operate in an alliance of convenience. AQ provides funds to the Taliban and the Taliban allow AQ to operate with impunity from their areas of control. Given the history of Afganistan and it's inability to have ever formed a functional government for any length of time, Iraq's future is far more promising.

machangezi

They have every reason to. Iran is not Afghanistan and the west shouldn't make the mistake of generalizing them. I find it very amusing that many westerners consider Iranians fucked up back ward especially the ones who know nothing about Iran. I have been there several times and the last time was in Jan, 1999. Believe me when I say that Tehran is ten times more organized, cleaner and beautiful city than Bangkok. The girls are of course one of the most beautiful ones. It is unfortunate that they are being ruled by fanatics and extremists but the west should consider this fact that they are 70% responsible in bringing them on the scene. President Eisenhower ordered the covert operation code named operation Ajax bringing the Shah in power.

Butterfly

Iranians girls are absolutely hot, they need to be liberated for sure

Butterfly

Your best post ever.

Probably summarize your knowledge of the whole world and how it works ?

can you do "push up" ?

machangezi

Still you don't fail to run your mouth, now do you?

That is because you are an American. When Pakistani intelligence agency ISI is blamed for bombings in India I also doubt it. When my Bangladeshi friend told me about the killings of 3 million Bangladeshis by Pakistan Army in 1971 war between India and Pakistan, I had my doubts but I know the truth now and I openly say that Pakistan army did wrong. I think accepting one's fault is a higher thing than playing the blame game but that is my thought and I can be wrong.

machangezi

Do you know this??....... America was arming Saddam all the way through Iran-Iraq war. Although Saddam invaded Iraq yet we didn't see the Global cops do anything to stop the bastard ... instead they sent money, intelligence and weapons to Saddam directly and indirectly during the war.

machangezi