Contact lost with Malaysia Plane.

[Troy]

My theory of it landing on Cloudbase and then being whisked off to the South Pole is still in the running....

...only it seems that the Mysterons attacked Cloudbase and the 777 was pushed overboard in the ensuing skirmish. Possibly a result of that racist Colonel White and his refusal to listen to Capt Black. I reckon a couple of hours torturing Harmony with Piwi posts would break her into telling everyone the real truth....

[ENT]

..surely the world would have been given a motive by now.....

The silence is deafening.

[blue]

so whats next ?
they find and recover the black boxes - after lots of drama but they have wiped themselves clean ?

[Ronin]

The problem I have with sabotage is the same one I have with the suicide theory...surely the world would have been given a motive by now, either by the saboteurs or the pilot as he was about to die.

The whole problem is everybody has theories but nobody has proven facts. From what I see nobody wants to admit that whatever happened may well be something that has never happened before (seems likely we could be in for a shock). I don't know how accurate it is but it seems the police have an idea of what may have happened but aren't making it public (article in New Straits Times).

[koman]

The problem I have with sabotage is the same one I have with the suicide theory...surely the world would have been given a motive by now, either by the saboteurs or the pilot as he was about to die.

The whole problem is everybody has theories but nobody has proven facts. From what I see nobody wants to admit that whatever happened may well be something that has never happened before (seems likely we could be in for a shock). I don't know how accurate it is but it seems the police have an idea of what may have happened but aren't making it public (article in New Straits Times).

The known facts are so limited; almost everything is guesswork. The world demands answers and those who are supposed to know are pressured to come up with answers; but without hard facts, it's not possible to produce hard answers.

When someone makes a comment or takes a guess that turns out to be incorrect, they are accused of telling lies; hiding something, incompetence, et al. The brave new world of the internet cannot accept the simple fact that we don't always know what happened, or why it happened...at least not within the limited attention span of the news media and the general public.

In due course this mystery will likely be solved, but it could take months, years or even decades.....or we could get lucky and find the AC complete with black boxes loaded with all the answers tomorrow. This will not satisfy some folks however....and a new thread will be started about how the CIA set the whole thing up, including faking black box recordings and fake wreckage to keep us from knowing the "truth;" while the Chinese engineers (who were employees of a US company anyway) are being rendered on Diego Garcia....

[ENT]

It's down to what the plane was carrying, and who wanted to nick it.
No sudden and catastrophic failure of the plane, no pilot suicide or jihadist exercise.

Possible high value cargoes carried are gold/gems/bullio, or a dastardly fiendish military machine, or a microchip along with info, as in 20 scientists employed by Freescale, or drugs.

If the plane did in fact ditch in the Indian Ocean after 7 hours, it was deliberately ditched after the aim of the hijack was achieved, by whom is as yet undetermined, but not until then, if at all.

[Thormaturge]

It's down to what the plane was carrying, and who wanted to nick it.
No sudden and catastrophic failure of the plane, no pilot suicide or jihadist exercise.

Possible high value cargoes carried are gold/gems/bullio....

mangosteen.

If the plane did in fact ditch in the Indian Ocean after 7 hours, it was deliberately ditched after the aim of the hijack was achieved, by whom is as yet undetermined, but not until then, if at all.

...the aim possibly being to make the point that the threat to ditch the plane wasn't a bluff.

...and then on to a second (MHo66), and if no money is forthcoming, a third.

[baldrick]

as in 20 scientists

ok - list their "scientific" qualifications

admin assistant to the lead eng in charge of heatsink design is not a scientist

[ENT]

Their names are on the passenger manifest, but their degree/quals levels are only referred to as "scientists" in most media reports. But so what, does an admin assistant in the group makes them all non-scientists?

As electronics and computer technicians they are scientists.

[Latindancer]

a dastardly fiendish military machine

Destined for the utterly dastardly Fu Manchu, of course .


All the same, it does seem odd that the cargo manifest has not been publicly released.

[Necron99]

a dastardly fiendish military machine

Destined for the utterly dastardly Fu Manchu, of course .


All the same, it does seem odd that the cargo manifest has not been publicly released.

Have you ever seen the cargo manifest published in any other disaster?

[ENT]

Personally, no.

Disasters don't publish manifests,.

MA and Malaysian customs dept. may publish the full manifest, but so far have been obfuscating about a bunch of mangosteens on board but nothing else, refusing to give a clear picture or description of events that adds up.

[ENT]

So what's so TOP SECRET about the cargo that authorities can't publish the manifest?

They're happy enough to give detailed descriptions of how the mangosteen and their previous harvesters and packers were meticulously checked out to make sure that the mangosteens could be ruled out as a motive for stealing the plane.

Those same authorities go into great debate about a bunch of lithium batteries, as though the'd blown the plane up, which of course doesn't appear to be the case, of course.

No mention of anything else in the cargo bay, in fact only a wall of silence, so the Malaysians are deliberately hiding the identity/description of goods carried.

Why?

Were those goods carried in breach of IATA rules?

Even better,...was that secret cargo uninsurable? Illegal?

[Thormaturge]

No mention of anything else in the cargo bay,

Probably just a few bags of fertiliser; nothing to get worked up about.

[baldrick]

this thread goes a way to explaining the attraction so many people have to soap operas

Even better,...was that secret cargo uninsurable? Illegal?

would it change your life if it was ?

[ENT]

No mention of anything else in the cargo bay,

Probably just a few bags of fertiliser; nothing to get worked up about.

Not a bad reason for going shtum.

[ENT]

Even better,...was that secret cargo uninsurable? Illegal?

would it change your life if it was ?

What's that got to do with the price of fish?

[Latindancer]

I don't remember there ever having been anyone previously question what was in the hold after a plane crash or disappearance (indeed, this disappearance is unique, which is why we're all fascinated with it).

They're happy enough to give detailed descriptions of how the mangosteen and their previous harvesters and packers were meticulously checked out to make sure that the mangosteens could be ruled out as a motive for stealing the plane.

Good point.


Tell you what : if there WAS anything dodgy in there, the phrase "no-one here but us mangosteens" will become a widely used put-down for quite some time

[VocalNeal]

I don't remember there ever having been anyone previously question what was in the hold after a plane crash or disappearance (indeed, this disappearance is unique, which is why we're all fascinated with it).

Probably 2T of Durians as well.

[ENT]

How and why the cargo manifest fits in;

Air cargo manifest
A document issued by an aircraft operator, and available in hard copy or electronic form. This document contains the details of consignments loaded on to a specified flight, and provides a list of all the air waybill and master air waybill numbers referring to the goods loaded on to an aircraft. The nature of the goods, weight, and number of pieces composing each consignment on a specified flight, and the unit of loading used, are also identified in this document.

Air waybill
Master air waybill
House air waybill
A document prepared by or on behalf of a shipper that evidences the contract between the shipper and aircraft operator(s) for the carriage ofgoods over routes of the operator(s). Air waybills have several purposes, but their two main functions are as a contract of carriage (behind every original air waybill are the conditions of contract for carriage), and as evidence of the receipt of goods. An air waybill is the most important document issued by an aircraft operator either directly or through its authorized agent (freight forwarder), and covers the transport of cargo from airport to airport.

Air waybills have eleven-digit numbers used to make bookings and to check the status of a delivery and the
current position of the shipment. The first three digits are the aircraft operator prefix.

Master air waybills are issued by or on behalf of freight forwarders offering a consolidation service. This document specifies the global contract between a freight forwarder (or consolidator) and aircraft operator(s) for the transportation of goods originated by more than one shipper bu destined for the same final State, airport or other destination. Master air waybills are linked to several house air waybills, and the master number may be used to trace a shipment with an aircraft operator.

A freight forwarder offering a consolidation service will issue its own air waybill to the shipper, called a house air
waybill, which may act as a multimodal transport document.

This is the contract between the freight forwarder and each shipper whose goods have been consolidated. There are two reference numbers on a house air waybill, the number of the master air waybill to which it is linked and the house air waybill number itself, which is always different from one freight forwarder to another, without limitations or standard digits, and which may be used to trace a
shipment with the freight forwarder.

Certificate of Origin
A specific form identifying the goods, in which the authority or body empowered to issue it certifies expressly that the
goods to which the certificate relates originate in a specific State. This certificate may also include a declaration by the
manufacturer, producer, supplier, exporter, or other competent person.

Customs release export A document whereby a Customs authority releases goods under its control to be placed at the disposal of the party concerned for export (alsocalled a Customs delivery note).

Customs release import Same as above but for import

Dangerous Goods Declaration
Document(s) issued by the consignor or shipper to certify that the dangerous goods being transported have been packaged, labelled, and declared in accordance with the provisions of international standards and conventions.

Export cargo declaration (departure)
A generic term applied to the document, also referred to as a freight declaration, providing the particulars required by Customs concerning outbound cargo carried by commercial means of transport.Import cargo declaration

(arrival) Same as above but for inbound cargo

Export goods declaration A document whereby goods are declared for export Customs clearance.

Import goods declaration A document whereby goods are declared for import Customs clearance.

House cargo manifest A document containing the same information as a cargo manifest as well as additional details on freight amounts, etc.

Invoice
A document required by Customs in an importing State in which an exporter states the invoice or other price (e.g. selling price or price of identical goods), and specifies costs for freight, insurance, and packing, as well as terms of delivery and payment, for the purpose of determining theCustoms value of goods in the importing State.

Packing list Documents specifying which goods are in each package.

[Sailing into trouble]

It has been reported that the sonar bouys that picked up a signal, is not from the Boeing at all. Guess someone is lurking in the depths with their secret submarine. Aussie PM says they are confident that the signals are from the black boxes and they should find the plane quickly. So probably it will take weeks.

So what did the islanders hear and see fly low overhead on the maldives the day the plane disappeared? Why has this been dismissed so quickly?

[ENT]

It has been reported that the sonar bouys that picked up a signal, is not from the Boeing at all. Guess someone is lurking in the depths with their secret submarine. Aussie PM says they are confident that the signals are from the black boxes and they should find the plane quickly. So probably it will take weeks.

So what did the islanders hear and see fly low overhead on the maldives the day the plane disappeared? Why has this been dismissed so quickly?

There are many autonomous submersible craft/beacons operating and pinging away in the VLF range these days, most of them ranging from a metre or so up to three metres in length, some staying away from "home" for many months at a time.

So no surprise that pings in the VLF to ELF range are being picked up. Interestingly, all the verifiable pings received so far appear to be below the frequency allocated to MH 370's black box pinger, in the next waveband below the b/box's waveband, thus in the upper ELF range.
So likely military.

The Maldives sighting of an airliner on 8th March at dawn there can't be fobbed off as nothing!

That little piece of info is gonna be raised further in future.

[blue]

I understood a black box pings it's singal at short range, a few miles, maybe 5 ?
so how can these mystery singnls be them ?

[Bobcock]

The Maldives sighting of an airliner on 8th March at dawn there can't be fobbed off as nothing!

Link.....

[Necron99]

I understood a black box pings it's singal at short range, a few miles, maybe 5 ?
so how can these mystery singnls be them ?

They could be in range, though sound can behave strangely in deep water.
Thermal inclines can act as mirrors, bouncing sound waves far beyond the expected distance.