Ex Pat finances

[nigelandjan]

Hi all expats in Thaialnd.

It is my intention and has been for a long time to retire in Thailand before I reach pensionable age , now for me to be able to do this I will need to invest a large (ish ) sum of money to achieve a monthly income.

Preferably I would like to invest in a UK based bond scheme however I know a lot of those don't allow ex pats to invest as it will say UK based customers only ,, so the question is can any of you recommend a bond that is available for ex pats , preferably UK based i.e. operated over the internet , or even another reasonably safe worldwide bond Company / bank which is offering a monthly income.

I am under no illusions about finding a fortune bond , just a capital safe bond returning around 3.5%

Thanks in advance for any help

[taxexile]

if you meet the non resident requirements, you can open an offshore bank account in jersey or the i.o.m. etc. and receive interest without paying tax on it. you can open the account at any time, but only receive interest tax free once you are out of the eu area.

some fixed term and rate accounts pay as much as 5.5% p.a. interest.


you will not need to pay capital gains tax on certain investments if you sell them in the year after you declare non residency.

speak to an accountant who knows his way around the non residency regulations well before you leave, you may be able to save having to pay a substantial amount of tax, all quite legally by the way.

if you are married and have complete trust in the relationship, transferring assets will enable you to save a lot of tax too.

you need to plan well in advance though and take professional advice, from a knowledgeable accountant rather than a financial advisor who just wants to sell you bonds and investments.

[Albert Shagnastier]

How much you got?
(85k stirling could get you 7-8% if you invest it in a property)

[buriramboy]

Personally i'd split your money between a number of high dividend paying stocks rather than a bond but that's just me.

[Thetyim]

Try here

Fixed Income Investor - Bond Prices & Yields - Bond Prices & Yields

[DrAndy]

Preferably I would like to invest in a UK based bond scheme however I know a lot of those don't allow ex pats to invest as it will say UK based customers only ,, so the question is can any of you recommend a bond that is available for ex pats , preferably UK based i.e. operated over the internet , or even another reasonably safe worldwide bond Company / bank which is offering a monthly income. I am under no illusions about finding a fortune bond , just a capital safe bond returning around 3.5%

I bought £50K worth of bonds when I was working in Bkk many years ago, as an expat

they performed badly over the years, dropping to £35K at the worst point

I got fed up with them and sold them for £53K recently, a loss when you take into account inflation

they have lots of hidden charges every year so even if they are doing badly the company rakes in their money

don't bother, they are a bad investment unless you are lucky, nothing to do with the pathetic companies that run them

[DrAndy]

some fixed term and rate accounts pay as much as 5.5% p.a. interest.

yes, but you are losing out on the capital loss

the £ and $ are dropping in value all the time due to the inflationary policies

[Albert Shagnastier]

^ I agree.
Don't invest with banks.

[Spin]

Lots of Thai banks are offering bonds at 3.5% now. Not sure of the rules for farangs investing though.

How come you don't just invest in a Pattaya beer bar like everybody else?

[Aussie Tigger]

At your stage in life be conservative,fixed term deposits allow you to sleep at night.
As we get older risk taking is not wise.
Many in Australia now are transferring their Superannuation money into term deposits after recent years of watching their life savings slowly deplete in value.

[bakseedar]

I've just started running a forex automated system which claims 5 - 10% per MONTH.. It's a free one month trial.. One week in & showing 3% already.

[taxexile]

At your stage in life be conservative,fixed term deposits allow you to sleep at night.

very true, and you just cant put a price on that peace of mind.

ive also had bonds and stuff that have never performed as well as i expected, maybe thats down to my financial naivety, but as someone who has always managed to live comfortably and happily within my income, rather than needing a certain income to support a lifestyle, my present investment strategy suits me perfectly and i have yet to touch my capital and i know exactly what i will have coming in every year.

[Butterfly]

How come you don't just invest in a Pattaya beer bar like everybody else?

best advice ever

[Butterfly]

Try here

Fixed Income Investor - Bond Prices & Yields - Bond Prices & Yields

those yields have an embedded credit risk and call risk you need to take into account before buying them

they are not comparable on a straight forward basis, they are misleading without additional information on their structure

[Butterfly]

some fixed term and rate accounts pay as much as 5.5% p.a. interest.

yes, but you are losing out on the capital loss

the £ and $ are dropping in value all the time due to the inflationary policies

that's one of the feature of bonds most normal people seem to misunderstand, they can lose value, and they do. They can also be very risky, despite what many believe to be safe. In terms of risk, they carry significant risk that can't be calculated easily, you need to know what you are buying, and this can be a complex process for most.

one of the feature of bonds is that their value revert to par as they age, therefore if you buy at a premium, you are guarantee to make a capital loss for a given yield at the time of purchase.

[Butterfly]

Hi all expats in Thaialnd.

It is my intention and has been for a long time to retire in Thailand before I reach pensionable age , now for me to be able to do this I will need to invest a large (ish ) sum of money to achieve a monthly income.

Preferably I would like to invest in a UK based bond scheme however I know a lot of those don't allow ex pats to invest as it will say UK based customers only ,, so the question is can any of you recommend a bond that is available for ex pats , preferably UK based i.e. operated over the internet , or even another reasonably safe worldwide bond Company / bank which is offering a monthly income.

I am under no illusions about finding a fortune bond , just a capital safe bond returning around 3.5%

Thanks in advance for any help

I would suggest buying some ETFs that invest into Hedge Funds, it would be less risky than buying a simple corporate bond.

Your objectives are based on risk assumptions that are not realistic, being a "renter" at a given yield will destroy your "investment" as soon as government yields go up or inflation go up.

The truth is that there is no safe investment these days with good returns, you need to take a minimum of risk. I would suggest investing in something you could do as a business or if it's a large amount, say 1M GBP, some UK REITs with large dividend income.

Regardless, you need to consult an IRA in the UK, possibly one you would pay directly, not one who would get paid by the "assets" he recommends.

[DrAndy]

be careful of the boiler room boys, they are still operating in Chiang Mai, for example

nasty, dirty thieves is the only way to describe them

[nigelandjan]

Thankyou lads for all your suggestions ,, I have just got in from work , so I have just viewed this.

I especially like your thinking Tax x ,, I shall be making an appointment to see an accountant , who specialises and has up to date ex pat knowledge.

Taking on board a lot of what you are suggesting going over Tax x it looks highly likely that I shall ( fingers crossed ) be able to put my feet up earlier

[nigelandjan]

BTW I will only be looking at investing in 100% capital safe bonds , yes I know the return is lower but thats the way I'll be going , whats left when I am gone will be to take good care of my wife , so I aint gonna cock that up.


On the plus side no ones sent me a link from our Nigerian 125% investment teams

[OhOh]

I would suggest buying some ETFs that invest into Hedge Funds,

You may want to investigate the high frequency scams going on in electronic bonds and stocks.

Be careful of all charges if you decide on a "Financial advisor".

100% capital safe bonds

No bond/eft/share investment is 100% Safe, recent share crashes of 40%, money disappearing of alleged customer accounts etc., except a bank account with a UK government guarantee. Even these are limited to £80,000 per account. All "investments have risks, some more than others.

Whether their will be any value in the £'s that are offerd after any upcoming crash is debatable.

100% capital safe bonds

Check the fine print as to who is guaranteeing the capital, which insurance company and the safety of their assets backing up the guarantee.

My two pennth.

Buy physical gold, as much as you can safely store. Last two years profit of 19% per year (38%), priced in THB and you still have the capital available when you want to cash the gold in; anywhere in the world and at any time.

But as it has been said "It's up to you"

[OhOh]

I would suggest investing in something you could do as a business

A second option is to buy a Thai trucking business, you know the ropes, there are thousands of trucks in Thailand - with no rail competition and you can have as much hands on management as you wish.

[glennb6]

with the financial world hanging by a thread, the 2008 financial crisis simply whitewashed (not fixed), the ponzi finances beginning to come undone.... I believe that most pensioners will be lucky if they HAVE a govt pension in a couple years, and if they still do, if the money will be able to buy much but rice and bugs.

[nigelandjan]

Cheers for that OO , I was under the illusion I had seen some 100% capital safe bonds in the UK somewhere ,, I thought the NSI lot issued them oh well

A second option is to buy a Thai trucking business, you know the ropes, there are thousands of trucks in Thailand - with no rail competition and you can have as much hands on management as you wish.

The last thing I'm gonna do mate is have ANY form of business least of all poxy lorries I've had a lifetime of driving them / running them I'm retiring mate and the sooner the better

[Butterfly]

I shall be making an appointment to see an accountant , who specialises and has up to date ex pat knowledge.

not saying all accountants are bad, but they are NOT the right person to ask for investment advice. You might find one who might know more than usual, from a recommendation, but by definition an accountant doesn't have skills in investment recommendations. All they do is record revenues and cost, and try to save taxes. Some tax accountants might make risky investments for their clients to save taxes, not to make money, so it's also something you need to consider.

BTW I will only be looking at investing in 100% capital safe bonds

there is no such thing as 100% capital safe bond, unless it's a government saving bonds, but we know what to expect in terms of poor performance, not enough to keep with inflation.

[Butterfly]

be careful of the boiler room boys, they are still operating in Chiang Mai, for example

nasty, dirty thieves is the only way to describe them

they are also quite present in Bangkok, the fuckers. I had one nest near my home before (see thread)

they are also selling "Expat Life Insurance" packages, not a scam per se, but full of hidden fees where they make a killing, something like 7% or 8% per year in hidden fees.