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Butterfly · 21-06-2008, 09:34 AM

Well, despite making calls about his character and how he will bring back honor to the Oval office, he proved once again to be a fraud, a cowardly leader with no sense of dignity, and a total lack of character beyond the average Frat boy screaming fest,

And apparently those who have been close to him, also agree. He is shifty, and has no sense of right or wrong beyond the Hollywood definition,

here what the WSJ has to say:

Quote:

Originally Posted by WSJ

McClellan Testifies on Plame Affair
Ex-Press Secretary Denounces
'Secretive White House'

WASHINGTON -- Former presidential spokesman Scott McClellan on Friday said President Bush has lost the public's trust by failing to open up about his administration's mistakes and backtracking on a promise to tell all about the leak of CIA operative Valerie Plame's identity.

"This White House promised or assured the American people that at some point when this was behind us they would talk publicly about it. And they have refused to," Mr. McClellan told the House Judiciary Committee. "And that's why I think more than any other reason we are here today and the suspicion still remains."

The former White House press secretary suggested that Mr. Bush could do much to redeem his credibility on the Plame matter and his reasons for going to war in Iraq if he would embrace "openness and candor and then constantly strive to build trust across the aisle."

"This is a very secretive White House," Mr. McClellan said. "There's some things that they would prefer not to be talked about."

The White House was dismissive of the event and Mr. McClellan himself. Presidential spokesman Tony Fratto disputed Mr. McClellan's assertion that that Plame matter concluded with the conviction of I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby, citing an ongoing lawsuit by Ms. Plame and her husband, former ambassador Joseph Wilson, against current and former administration officials.

"The White House has the consistent position that we would refrain from comment while there was ongoing litigation," Mr. Fratto said. "Scott must have forgotten the policy he repeatedly stated from the podium."

Mr. McClellan cited other examples of Mr. Bush's lack of candor, including what he called the "packaging" of intelligence to justify the Iraq war and the president's handling of allegations that many years ago he used cocaine.

In his recently released book, "What Happened: Inside the Bush White House and Washington's Culture of Deception," Mr. McClellan recounts overhearing Mr. Bush on the telephone telling a supporter that "I honestly don't remember whether I tried it or not." Mr. McClellan called that kind of response to sensitive questions by Mr. Bush and other politicians "essentially evasion."

"That [approach] later transferred over to issues of policy," Mr. McClellan said. "It tells something about his character."

Mr. Bush's spokesman from 2003 to 2006, Mr. McClellan said that former White House Chief of Staff Andy Card told him that the president and vice president wanted him to publicly say that Mr. Libby, Vice President Dick Cheney's chief of staff at the time, was not involved in the leak.

"I was reluctant to do it," Mr. McClellan said. "I got on the phone with Scooter Libby and asked him point-blank, 'Were you involved in this in any way?' And he assured me in unequivocal terms that he was not."

In fact, both Mr. Libby and former presidential adviser Karl Rove had discussed Ms. Plame's identity with reporters. Mr. Libby resigned from office the day he was indicted on charges of covering up the leak. Mr. Rove remained, eventually leaving office in August 2007. Mr. Rove has never been charged in the case.

Ms. Plame maintains the White House quietly outed her to reporters as retribution for criticism from her husband of Mr. Bush's reasons for going to war in Iraq.

Under questioning by Rep. Brad Sherman (D., Calif.), Mr. McClellan agreed with Ms. Plame's assessment. "My belief is ... it was part of the effort to discredit Ambassador Wilson," Mr. McClellan said.

Last July, Mr. Bush commuted Mr. Libby's sentence, sparing him from serving any prison time. "It was special treatment," Mr. McClellan said of the commutation.

Mr. McClellan told the House Judiciary Committee that he doesn't know if a crime was committed and does not believe that Mr. Bush knew about or directed the leak. When asked about Mr. Cheney, he replied: "I do not know. There's a lot of suspicion there."

Mr. Bush backtracked on his promise of accountability in the Plame matter, Mr. McClellan said. The White House had said in 2003 that anyone who leaked classified information in the case would be dismissed. Mr. Bush reiterated that promise in June 2004. By July 2005, Mr. Bush qualified his position, saying he would fire anyone for leaking classified information if that person had "committed a crime." He then commuted Mr. Libby's sentence.

Mr. McClellan said the White House helped the Justice Department investigate the leak, but he knew of no internal White House probe to ferret out and fire the leaker.

Republicans cast his testimony as old news. Ranking Republican Lamar Smith of Texas questioned the impartiality of Mr. McClellan's publisher and said that whatever Mr. McClellan had been instructed to say about the Plame affair was typical work of the White House press office.

"It should be of no surprise that there was spin in the White House Press Office," said Mr. Smith. "What White House has not had a communications operation that advocates for its policies? Any recent administration that did not try to promote its priorities should be cited for dereliction of duty."

• Remarks: "What I Know" About Plame Episode

Copyright © 2008 Associated Press

sabang · 21-06-2008, 11:29 AM

The bush administration will at least serve as testimony of how fragile the basis of our democracy really is. Hopefully, people will not be as easily fooled again. I think the USA, specifically the judiciary, should also limit the power of the Presidential office, and make it more transparent and accountable.

Texpat · 21-06-2008, 11:49 AM

Nobody was fooled.
He was voted president, twice.
He is but one man in a huge, huge government. Hardly acting alone.
We always look for the best course of action and live with the decisions made.
You don't have to like it, but whining won't change anything.

sabang · 21-06-2008, 12:07 PM

You don't have to like it either Tex, nobody does, but lets face it- the vast majority of this world will breathe a collective sigh of relief to see the back of the abysmal Bush administration.

britmaveric · 21-06-2008, 12:08 PM

Ahh a lad who's primary motivation is selling books for a pile of dosh? I think his credibility is zero and really has no relevance.

thehighlander959 · 21-06-2008, 12:09 PM

At least this is a proper democratically elected government? Although Al Gore would beg to differ. After the Florida vote shambles,and Jed Bush being involved? Democracy even republican democracy is not perfect. Honesty is never the best policy ask any politician, he,ll kiss your baby and then double the price of the babies milk. All politics is a dirty game played by dirty people who all have one thing in common. THAT IS TO LINE THEIR OWN POCKETS AND FUCK EVERYONE ELSE!! It doesn,t matter which country you live in.

Carnwadrick · 21-06-2008, 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sabang

the vast majority of this world will breathe a collective sigh of relief to see the back of the abysmal Bush administration.

You may also have to bend over and kiss your ass goodbye..the world was heading towards total disaster guided by all the fuckwits with their heads up their assholes ignoring the maniacal terrorist threats around the world..George Bush took a stand and the world has taken a turn for the better..Spain and England took a little beating because they were weak willed and the fuckers knew who to hit but America has not been touched because George W took the fight to them...all you shit head merikan haters will some day thank the man (or maybe not because you hate to be wrong) for making the world just a little bit safer.

Morden · 21-06-2008, 12:25 PM

Surely, it's too late, far too late, for that man to gain any credibility. He gives the impression that he is lacking in intelligence, inarticulate, rude and ignorant, uncaring, smug and sneering. Probably, he is just the mouthpiece for others who are really running that country and doesn't really know what's going on.

The job of US President is undeniably one of the most influential in the world. The jobholder, or the powerful people behind him, can either make peace or start wars. Sadly, the voters of the US show a disturbing lack of judgement in their choices.

sabang · 21-06-2008, 12:27 PM

I can't be bothered debating with a Bush apologist- lets just say the majority of the world agrees with me. But of course, you are Right- everyone else is wrong.

Butterfly · 21-06-2008, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Texpat

Nobody was fooled.
He was voted president, twice.

The American public disagree with you, they were fooled, once by an illegal war, and twice with an election fraud,

Quote:

Originally Posted by Texpat

He is but one man in a huge, huge government. Hardly acting alone.

That's what leaders do, move the shit behind them, but he couldn't do that as he is a sheep and a coward taking orders from his masters,

he is a poor excuse of a president, and you are an apologist, you would probably have the same argument if he was Polpot or Mao,

Marmite the Dog · 21-06-2008, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carnwadrick

the world was heading towards total disaster guided by all the fuckwits with their heads up their assholes ignoring the maniacal terrorist threats around the world..George Bush took a stand and the world has taken a turn for the better

Are you on drugs?

You must be seriously demented to believe that crock of shit.

Carnwadrick · 21-06-2008, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sabang

I can't be bothered debating with a Bush apologist- lets just say the majority of the world agrees with me. But of course, you are Right- everyone else is wrong

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marmite the Dog

Are you on drugs? You must be seriously demented to believe that crock of shit.

Just expressing my opinion it is still a free world (in places) where we are allowed to do that.

sabang · 21-06-2008, 12:50 PM

No problem there- and your opinion is welcome. The subject of the Bush admin has been debated ad infinitum though, here and elsewhere- whixh is why I can't be bothered with it again. It usually ends up with the same tired old cliches.

The subject of the next administration is more prominent in our minds now.

Marmite the Dog · 21-06-2008, 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carnwadrick

Just expressing my opinion it is still a free world (in places) where we are allowed to do that.

Fair enough. Just surprised that someone would think that way when it's patently untrue.

Butterfly · 21-06-2008, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carnwadrick

Just expressing my opinion it is still a free world (in places) where we are allowed to do that.

well, nothing wrong to express a stupid opinion, except that your like would love to limit freedom of expression when we expose your stupidity and your lies,

Carnwadrick · 21-06-2008, 12:57 PM

^ Don't be so surprised, there are plenty like me.

Butterfly · 21-06-2008, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carnwadrick

^ Don't be so surprised, there are plenty like me.

still a minority these days, a few delusional and losers with no vision or moral,

Milkman · 21-06-2008, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by britmaveric

Ahh a lad who's primary motivation is selling books for a pile of dosh? I think his credibility is zero and really has no relevance.

Yes, some will question motivation of McClellan.

Did he change his views, and reveal being disenchanted?

Or, is he trying to clean his name up, because he's associated with the Iraq debacle? Especially since he was Press Secretray?

Money? I don't think income is the objective, IMO. He was the former Press Secretary for the POTUS, and I believe he has a law degree.

After GWB leaves office there will likely be more "memoirs" written and published. I think there may be more criticism of GWB.

And, Butterfly, we know you cited your source but we need a link in issues.

Cheers.

Texpat · 21-06-2008, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Butterfly

he is a poor excuse of a president

I would agree he is a poor president.

Quote:

and you are an apologist

In order to be an apologist, I would have to apologize for him and his actions.
Clearly, I'm not an apologist as I do not apologise for President Bush.

Please try to use your cliches correctly.

21-06-2008, 11:29 AM	#2 (permalink)
sabang Watching the Wheels Last Online: Today 05:33 PM Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: east of Pattaya Posts: 8,301	The bush administration will at least serve as testimony of how fragile the basis of our democracy really is. Hopefully, people will not be as easily fooled again. I think the USA, specifically the judiciary, should also limit the power of the Presidential office, and make it more transparent and accountable. __________________ To err is human. To blame someone else is politics.

21-06-2008, 12:09 PM	#6 (permalink)
thehighlander959 Kamphaeng Phet Last Online: Today 06:40 PM Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 334	At least this is a proper democratically elected government? Although Al Gore would beg to differ. After the Florida vote shambles,and Jed Bush being involved? Democracy even republican democracy is not perfect. Honesty is never the best policy ask any politician, he,ll kiss your baby and then double the price of the babies milk. All politics is a dirty game played by dirty people who all have one thing in common. THAT IS TO LINE THEIR OWN POCKETS AND FUCK EVERYONE ELSE!! It doesn,t matter which country you live in. __________________ "Don,t fck with the baldies

21-06-2008, 11:49 AM	#3 (permalink)
Texpat ฝรั่งพูดมาก Last Online: Today 06:06 PM Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Nong Khai Posts: 9,482	Nobody was fooled. He was voted president, twice. He is but one man in a huge, huge government. Hardly acting alone. We always look for the best course of action and live with the decisions made. You don't have to like it, but whining won't change anything.

21-06-2008, 12:07 PM	#4 (permalink)
sabang Watching the Wheels Last Online: Today 05:33 PM Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: east of Pattaya Posts: 8,301	You don't have to like it either Tex, nobody does, but lets face it- the vast majority of this world will breathe a collective sigh of relief to see the back of the abysmal Bush administration.

21-06-2008, 12:08 PM	#5 (permalink)
britmaveric nid aur yw popeth melyn Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Pattaya Posts: 2,679	Ahh a lad who's primary motivation is selling books for a pile of dosh? I think his credibility is zero and really has no relevance.

21-06-2008, 12:25 PM	#8 (permalink)
Morden Nakhon Ratchasima Last Online: 23-09-2008 05:57 PM Join Date: May 2008 Location: Korat Posts: 249	Surely, it's too late, far too late, for that man to gain any credibility. He gives the impression that he is lacking in intelligence, inarticulate, rude and ignorant, uncaring, smug and sneering. Probably, he is just the mouthpiece for others who are really running that country and doesn't really know what's going on. The job of US President is undeniably one of the most influential in the world. The jobholder, or the powerful people behind him, can either make peace or start wars. Sadly, the voters of the US show a disturbing lack of judgement in their choices.

21-06-2008, 12:27 PM	#9 (permalink)
sabang Watching the Wheels Last Online: Today 05:33 PM Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: east of Pattaya Posts: 8,301	I can't be bothered debating with a Bush apologist- lets just say the majority of the world agrees with me. But of course, you are Right- everyone else is wrong.

21-06-2008, 12:50 PM	#13 (permalink)
sabang Watching the Wheels Last Online: Today 05:33 PM Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: east of Pattaya Posts: 8,301	No problem there- and your opinion is welcome. The subject of the Bush admin has been debated ad infinitum though, here and elsewhere- whixh is why I can't be bothered with it again. It usually ends up with the same tired old cliches. The subject of the next administration is more prominent in our minds now.

21-06-2008, 12:57 PM	#16 (permalink)
Carnwadrick Ratchaburi Last Online: Today 06:23 AM Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Dark side of paradise Posts: 482	^ Don't be so surprised, there are plenty like me.