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Accidental Ajarn

"I don't see what's wrong with Marx Communism"

Wooooooo, dude, lay the bong down for awhile and come back to THIS planet.

good2bhappy

There are some interesting concepts raised by Marx and some of the neo communists like Collins.
Greater worker participation in company ownership etc

Butterfly

Did you read it ? his understanding of our modern society through the means of production were revolutionary, master and slave cohabitations and interdependence,

great work,

good2bhappy

Das capital and The Origin of Species were landmarks in history

Butterfly

^ you forgot Rousseau who was the first to really describe the existence of our society,

Marx brought it to a whole different level, much more advanced and sophisticated

Accidental Ajarn

Yes I have read Marx, as well as Adam Smith.

Marx was a joke. He was a lifelong student who never achieved anything. Finally he bought a degree from the German version of Khao San road. His theories had NO Empirical basis to them. Adam Smith on the other hand did base his theories on empirical research (maybe considered a little crude by today's standard but of extremely high standards of his day).

If anyone has studied psychology or sociology knows why Marxism can never work. Humans respond to incentives.

Von Mises really has explained it best. Marxism is government imposition of behaviour. How can the government impose its will? Only one way, through force or the threat of force. Markets through are based on voluntarily actions. If you don’t want to drink alcohol, don’t, if you don’t want to give money to the church, don’t. Market economies, not only is more efficient it also allows people of differing values to coexist peacefully. Marxism results in the forced imposition of one set of values on all.

Every country that has employed Marxist practices has only succeeded in creating poverty, misery, pollution, infant morality and fear.

Really really stupid idea. It has been tried in many different contexts and has failed miserably each time.

Let me decide what career to have, how to spend my money and my time, I do not need nor do I want the State to run my life. I know what is better for me than any central planner knows.

Butterfly

^ Adam Smith was a fraud and living in the cloud, still interesting to read

Wasn't Marx running a small factory at some point ? and this is how he came to his conclusions that capitalism was destroying lives and there could be another way ?

More on the man here, not the best source, but good enough I guess:

Karl Marx - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

AntRobertson

Say what you like about Marx, his theories were the basis for something that continues to have a significant impact on world politics and relations to this very day.

good2bhappy

Sorry please explain

Butterfly

^^ without Marx and Communism, pulling 50hours a week would be considered normal, and spending 2 weeks vacation overseas would be a thing reserved for the elite only,

good2bhappy

The victorian worker had it good
How have the mighty fallen

Accidental Ajarn

"Say what you like about Marx, his theories were the basis for something that continues to have a significant impact on world politics and relations to this very day."

Negative effect

"Sorry please explain"

There is very strong correlation between poverty and infant mortality. Infant mortality is a key measure used in "quality" of life. Marxism creates poverty and poverty leads to dead babies.

But, Chomsky does not care. Let em die, he doesn't see them from his ivory tower.

Leftist are the most uncaring people in the world. They openly advocate policies that have been shown to lead to death and miserly. Why? Political gain for them is more important than the lives of the world's poor.

good2bhappy

you meant infant mortality.
Infant morality had me puzzled.
What about Cuba, its infant mortality is lower than the US and on a par with the European Union average?

AntRobertson

I was going to say much the same thing.

Actually if you look at worldwide healthcare as a whole it's interesting to note that nations with a more 'socialist' focus in their approach are - for the most part - ranked higher than those without (most notably the US who spend twice as much as any other country for less return).

Unsubstantiated guff.

__________________
The Revolution will be televised... Eleven o'clock... Channel 10.

Accidental Ajarn

Oh I now get it, you guys are a bunch of Marxists! Obviously it is impossible in the modern world to be a Marxist and be a critical thinker. The evidence is so overwhelming in support of market economies and against central planning that it would be impossible to evaluate the evidence and come to the conclusion that Marxism works.

The Festinger cognitive dissonance thing explains this attitude of you guys. You must have developed a Marxist view point sometime early in life, however this is incompatible with all available evidence. The human brain does not tolerate incompatibilities for long, therefore you have two choices, either change your worldviews or ignore the evidence. You guys (probably in a combination of consciously and subconsciously) have filtered out all information that does not fit into your existing beliefs in order to maintain your worldview. That is why you guys seem so thick! That is why you feel compelled to seek out propaganda (like Chomsky) to reinforce your political views!!!

And I thought you were just stupid!

Ant, obviously you have no idea what you are talking about. The correlation between free-economies and poverty reduction, life expectancy and lower of infant mortality has been found to be very strong in study after study after study. Anyone who has any interest at all in making the world a better place is OBILGATED to seek out this information before making political decisions. Ignoring all this valuable evidence borders on the criminal. Don’t believe me? Check out any of the issues of the last few years of the Asian Development Review. It’s available free online. But we both know you won’t do that. You don’t want to see any evidence conducted by real scholars who have devoted their lives to improving the plight of the world’s poor. It might upset your view of the world, instead you will seek out propaganda to reinforce you weird view of the world.

So. what do you base your worldviews on? Some anecdotal evidence about Cuba, a single country? Are you really that thick? (Also do you actually believe government statistics coming out of Cuba?). Wait, I think you have already answered the question about how thick you are.

good2bhappy

Another typo or a new theory?

good2bhappy

What was he saying about ad hominem arguments?

AntRobertson

Doesn't do irony our AA.

Accidental Ajarn

^

yep, you pretty much proved my point.

good2bhappy

^ You mean I proved you are a moron?
That was not my purpose