Thread: Methadone - the crapiest way to treat heroin addicts IMO.

I felt the need to start this thread cos CMN seems to be unhappy about us discussing methadone treatment on his thread.

To me methadone is another drug and the use of it as heroin substitute is absurd. Being an opiate use of methadone causes physical dependence and like heroin has its withdrawl symptoms once you decide to quit.

I'd really want to see how many members are in support of methadone way of treatment.

What are the alternatives Macha mate.

Cold turkey doesn't look like much fun.

I am neither supportive nor unsupportive of it.

It has it's pros and cons.

I have worked in places where the addict had to come for urine testing before they were given the methadone and didnt really see a lot of success.

There were however some people who could live a reasonable life while on it.

It took away the necessity of having to deal or commit crimes to finance the heroin addiction.

I agree, it is swapping one addiction for another, but it does allow people to live their lives with more dignity than an illegal heroin addiction does.

Originally Posted by Macha

I'd really want to see how many members are in support of methadone way of treatment.

That's one way to seperate the liberals from the conservatives ...

When my mate came off smack we just kept him out partying allthe time - lots of pills and billy to keep his mind of it.

If he had to use his works to shoot up he would bang a bit of speed into himself.

He didn't sleep for the first nine days he was off and then he crashed and slept for a bit.


He got banged up about four weeks into the cleanup and spent two weeks on remand with a smack head in his cell and never touched it.

He lasted 8 months until christmas where it all went wrong.

Nothing we could do.

^ That is what most of the methadone people do too.

Have the best intentions of staying off it, (heroin) but cant keep away from the culture.

Originally Posted by ChiangMai noon

What are the alternatives Macha mate.

Cold turkey doesn't look like much fun.

Cold Turkey most probably isn't fun, but why should it be.

When someone is using high addictive drugs like heroin, the only way IMO for them to rid themselves of the addiction is to go through cold turkey. Whats the point of substituting one drug for an other, it's not getting them anywhere.

Methadone supposedly works by supressing the withdrawal symptoms, and addicts using this can be safely weened from it over a period of time.

In reality, the number of addicts now dependent on methadone is enormous. The medical bill that the tax payers have to foot is huge, all because someone decided that a drug addict, through there own bloody fault, shouldn't have to go through cold turkey !

I've met a few junkies in my time and for the hard-core ones Methadone is really a waste of time.

They just do the M then look for some more heroin - ie: the Meth. saves them a bit of cash but they end up twice as pinned!

...or they just sell the meth. in the first place to buy a hit of the real stuff!


I agree with Macha - Methadone doesn't really solve the problem.

It has it's uses in some situations for dealing with addicts though.

"Like other opiates, it can creat physical dependence if taken regularly, but the "addiction" is more like the diabetic's "addiction" to insulin than a heroin addicts to product bought on the street." (Larry Finsterbusch, PhD)

Bottom line .. those countries like England and Australia that mentioned in the other thread fund methadone treatment programs on a masive scale in comparison to the USA.

^
yup, sleepy swanage in Tranquil Dorset is over run by Manc smackheads, getting their share of free methodone.

Originally Posted by Lily

^ That is what most of the methadone people do too..

The Swiss study I mentioned in the other thread claimed the opposite. They claimed drastic declines.

The recidivism rate among heroin addicts is very high - about 90%. Given the fact that only about 10% of all heroin addicts can successfully quit cold turkey Methadone can be useful in helping some addicts live more or less normal lives.

As a way of helping people quit, it's worthless. It's just substituting one addictive opiate for another.

Originally Posted by Fon Tok

In reality, the number of addicts now dependent on methadone is enormous. The medical bill that the tax payers have to foot is huge, all because someone decided that a drug addict, through there own bloody fault, shouldn't have to go through cold turkey !

Think about what you said from a fiscal responsibility sense ... don't you think it's cheaper in the long run for tax paying citizens to pay for programs like methadone than the alternatives like costs of higher crime and most importantly health care for heroin addicts. Just asking matey.

^ But we need a cure for that not to substitute right? Also methadone's way too expensive and the dependence is much much more than heroin. The withdrawl symptoms of methadone user is way too scary and painful.

The only benefit I can see in using methadone is that after a dose you can go to work and function properly. It will also give you, lets say 10 more years to live compared to heroin but its highly addictive, more than heroin, and quitting it is generally out of question.

Originally Posted by Storekeeper

Originally Posted by Lily

^ That is what most of the methadone people do too..

The Swiss study I mentioned in the other thread claimed the opposite. They claimed drastic declines.

I am only speaking about personal experience and I suppose the ones who did lapse, stay in my mind, because a group of the same people would front up again and again, starting all over again.

I have also said though, that some people lived a better life on methadone than heroin.

A lesser evil.

Some stories of methadone withdrawl:

I've been on both ends of withdrawals, heroin and methadone, every patient of methadone will always tell you the same, as I do; I can kick heroin anytime, but methadone that is something else. In 15 yrs of heroin addiction, I've kicked 3 times, 'cold-turkey'. In 10 years on methadone I've never kicked methadone.

Once I landed in jail, I had to do 72 hours of jail time before I got to see the judge. I was literally on the floor screaming my guts out. About 12 hours before I was to see the judge, I demanded to be taken to the hospital, I just couldn't take it. I was cuffed, and looking like a 'chair' was glued to my back, I limped to the ambulance, since I couldn't lift my leg to climb into the back, the police grabbed me on both sides and shoved me in like a sack of potatoes, I fell flat on my face. The doctor, realizing my condition and that it was severe, gave me a shot of methadone. The relief was immediate.

I was returned to the precinct and 2 days later I was in the same condition! Never did I go through such hell in all my days.

The intensity of methadone withdrawal is just too much! I could never do it. By the way, about 5 years ago one inmate went into convulsions and upon falling, he hit the metal bars and died!


»On Sunday morning, March 30, I took my last dose of methadone. I have been on 80 mgs of methadone for the past 6 months.

My doctor, an anesthesiologist, writes prescriptions for 125 tablets. This lasts 15 days. I signed a contract with him that basically says I will use the same pharmacy, I will not get meds from other physicians, and if I run out before the 15 days is up I just have to go without. I didn't mind signing the contract at all, and I have abided by all the stipulations. I called him for a refill on Friday. No response. I called again on Saturday. No response. I called his home on Sunday. No response. On Sunday I took my last dose. I hate anything having this much control over me. I find it very demeaning to be so dependent on a bottle of pills.

On Monday I called his office. They informed me that he was on vacation this week. Panic descended . . . and so did withdrawal symptoms. At first I just got kinda nervous, jittery. My doctor has told me that methadone is not addicting. That is contrary to everything and anything I've ever heard or read about the drug. I never questioned him why he thought methadone wasn't addicting. I was hoping I'd never have to find out. What my body went through for the next 48 hours was one severe blow after another. I kept trying to tell myself I just had the flu. Just crawl in bed for 3 days and sweat it out. Of course I knew this wasn't true but I was going to play whatever mind game it took to get me through this. After the jitters, the muscle contractures started. It felt like the muscles in my legs and then in my arms were like rubber bands, being stretched and pulled to their max and then constricting to a shape that wasn't natural. Then came the sweats, diarrhea, hallucinations.

I remember trying to dial the phone. It was a number I've called a thousand times before, only now I couldn't remember it. For that matter, I couldn't even hold the phone . . . I kept dropping it. My muscles were out of control. The pain that led me to methadone returned with a vengeance. In a strange way it was like an old friend. I knew it well and understood it completely. The combination of withdrawal and pain was too much. The all too familiar thoughts of suicide were returning.

It was now Tuesday morning. I called the pharmacist and explained the situation. By 1:10 PM I had 8 methadone tablets. I took the entire dose at once all 8 tablets. Within 2 hours my muscles had stopped screaming, my head was beginning to clear, and the pain was lessening.

It's now Thursday morning. I'm still not back to myself . . . but much better. The assault on my body was indeed very traumatic . . . I lost 7 pounds and am still very shaky. Addiction is indeed a dangerous thing and should be avoided. I must admit when I was in the throes of withdrawal there's not much I wouldn't have done to relieve the symptoms.

Originally Posted by Storekeeper

Originally Posted by Fon Tok

In reality, the number of addicts now dependent on methadone is enormous. The medical bill that the tax payers have to foot is huge, all because someone decided that a drug addict, through there own bloody fault, shouldn't have to go through cold turkey !

Think about what you said from a fiscal responsibility sense ... don't you think it's cheaper in the long run for tax paying citizens to pay for programs like methadone than the alternatives like costs of higher crime and most importantly health care for heroin addicts. Just asking matey.

My point is Storekeeper is that the tax payer ends up having to pay for the users addiction. Now if thats gonna be the case, why not just give them Heroin.

There are still second world war veterens that are given diamorphine prescriptions regularly for the last 60yrs after becoming addicted from it's use as a painkiller.

So, If we have to pay for the addiction, give them the real stuff, and not some synthetic opiate (bought from the greedy drugs company).

But, why should we have to pay for their addiction. Catch them, stick them in a special prison for 6 months, and let them go cold turkey.

We worked hard to keep him straight 9relatively speaking) it worked.

But once an addict always an addict and he slipped up.

Shame decent lad.

Stole my mountain bike though but I understood why.

Originally Posted by Macha

^ But we need a cure for that not to substitute right? Also methadone's way too expensive and the dependence is much much more than heroin. The withdrawl symptoms of methadone user is way too scary and painful.

Sure, that's a good point. But ... another big issue connected to this is drug legalization that many favor and some countries have enacted. Maybe it boils down to cost reduction vs harm reduction. It's all an interesting discussion and constatly debated by the two parties I mentioned earlier.

(Shut me up please ... I'm sounding like a friggin' liberal)

So, If we have to pay for the addiction, give them the real stuff, and not some synthetic opiate (bought from the greedy drugs company).

Spot on mate.

.... and the benefit of giving them real stuff is it will kill them 10 years quicker than methadone and hence savings on tax payers part.

^But he didnt have to go out and hit a granny over the head to get money for heroin.

Originally Posted by Lily

^But he didnt have to go out and hit a granny over the head to get money for heroin.

I don't get this post

Well you wouldnt, would you?

But it is out of sequence.