Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 67
  1. #1
    Thailand Expat

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Last Online
    17-07-2018 @ 10:23 AM
    Location
    chiangmai - bangkok
    Posts
    1,110

    bricks blocks building.....whats it all about?

    ѷ չͤ ӡѴ [Engine by iGetWeb.com] If you can read thai take a look if not like me look at the pics!

    So on reply to brick building i made in comment in another thread, and defying concrete post beam building because its expensive and over used and horrible(though i understand why its used and this is my own opinion).

    My question was why arent there more brick buildings as this would seem the logical affordable step for building.

    Whilst i know the above is not brick but block it gives some similarities in design and finished aesthetic. Whilst being made out of concrete it has colour mixed in to give a unique feel. The block is tied by rods through the brick as shown here(yes i pilfered this from titsvisa)







    This company is in sansai and the only one in Thailand apparently! There is a three bedroom house which has been made for the sum of 80,000 badt for just walls (shown below)








    The gentleman on tvisa said that the air on the inside felt much cooler then the outside space. It seems a simple way of constructing, and a cheap way as well, whilst it might not be to everyones tastes you cant argue against the other points namely price and cooling.

    What i am wondering is what other people think, and any other discussion to do with brick bloc building rather then concrete posts and fill in?

    What about cavity building? If you were to build a bond of bricks that stopped pests? What about brick bloc combo and so on....?

    Thank you kindly gentelman.
    im hot its so hot today.......milk was a bad choice!

  2. #2
    Thailand Expat
    dirtydog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Pattaya Jomtien
    Posts
    58,775
    Quote Originally Posted by benlovesnuk
    The block is tied by rods through the brick as shown here
    Where?

  3. #3
    lom
    lom is offline
    Thailand Expat lom's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Trapped in an old mans body
    Posts
    8,341
    ^ There are some in the drawing with the door and the window (also in the profile drawing to the left of it) but that looks like standard reinforcement around doors and windows.

  4. #4
    Thailand Expat
    Marmite the Dog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Last Online
    08-09-2014 @ 10:43 AM
    Location
    Simian Islands
    Posts
    34,827
    What a fucking horrible website.

  5. #5
    Hello World
    melvbot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Infinite Loop
    Posts
    5,931
    Quote Originally Posted by benlovesnuk View Post
    My question was why arent there more brick buildings as this would seem the logical affordable step for building.
    Because it would mean teaching Thais how to lay bricks properly, i.e in a straight line, not just having a 50 year old drunk woman fill in the wall gaps then have them rendered to cover up the botch.
    In other words a proper job and some level of craftmanship in building would be required.
    The Geek Shall Inherit The Earth

  6. #6
    Thailand Expat

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Last Online
    17-07-2018 @ 10:23 AM
    Location
    chiangmai - bangkok
    Posts
    1,110
    horrible website with some horrible buildings YES i agree, however a glimmer of hope amongst them was seen. Although they seem to be mostly for wall construction because they are cheap (however not as cheap as small clay brick).

    I have read alot of comments about their functionality and price which in turn attracts due to the simplicity of building, and it can achieve a reasonable result for greater area of space buildings, it is something I would consider over poured concrete.

    However in my mind there are some worries, namely constant wetting from heavy rain which a roof cannot protect(tall building), which means i am thinking of a double wall construction ie cavity wall. The block is so cheap that i can build a 2nd wall which should increase the inner walls efficeincy and strength giving a durabilty that maybe 1 wall would not have.

    What are people thoughts about this methodology and is it something that can be done in a real world situation?

    if you look on titvisa here youll get a better idea

    Rather Nice Building Bricks - Thailand Forum

    thanks for nay help i will post something more solid soon , i hope?

  7. #7
    Thailand Expat
    DrAndy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Last Online
    25-03-2014 @ 05:29 PM
    Location
    yes
    Posts
    32,028
    I have no problem with local bricklaying, but the bricks available are not hard enough for anything but infill

    I think this has been discussed several times before

    so what bricks are they using? he says they are concrete bricks, so not clay at all

    Quote Originally Posted by benlovesnuk
    The gentleman on tvisa said that the air on the inside felt much cooler then the outside space.
    maybe he said that, why should it be so? if it was bricks with cavity, maybe that helps, otherwise it would be the same as just using bricks as infill

    what are the foundations for the house? bricks?
    I have reported your post

  8. #8
    Thailand Expat

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Last Online
    17-07-2018 @ 10:23 AM
    Location
    chiangmai - bangkok
    Posts
    1,110
    Yes they are not bricks they are hollow concrete block, but they lay like bricks and are used in the same way(so thats why i wrongly call them so).

    They are not the clay bricks you find as previously discussed.

    These are proper concrete pre cast hollow blocks with steel rods as rebar with a poured concrete set around these rods. For foundations a concrete foundation is generally needed!

    It definitely doesnt have a cavity in this one, that is my suggestion, this wall was about 5inches thick or one block worth. The reason possibly for the cooling effect is the air gap which dominated the block. apart from that i have no idea why this would be?

    Any other suggestions?

    any other advice and information?

  9. #9
    Not a Mod.
    Begbie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Lagrangian Point
    Posts
    11,369
    ICF

    Saw this on discovery channel. Styrofoam blocks


  10. #10
    Thailand Expat
    DrAndy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Last Online
    25-03-2014 @ 05:29 PM
    Location
    yes
    Posts
    32,028
    Quote Originally Posted by benlovesnuk
    These are proper concrete pre cast hollow blocks with steel rods as rebar with a poured concrete set around these rods. For foundations a concrete foundation is generally needed!
    In the Uk they use polystyrene blocks which fit together like Lego; these also have a hole inside which is filled with rebar and concrete

    The walls go up very fast and straight

    They are strong and good insulators

  11. #11
    Thailand Expat
    dirtydog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Last Online
    @
    Location
    Pattaya Jomtien
    Posts
    58,775
    Quote Originally Posted by benlovesnuk
    The gentleman on tvisa said that the air on the inside felt much cooler then the outside space.
    Maybe actually get him to buy a temperature gauge, felt cooler really means shite.

  12. #12
    Thailand Expat

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Last Online
    17-07-2018 @ 10:23 AM
    Location
    chiangmai - bangkok
    Posts
    1,110
    Its rater interesting you posted about polystyrene and styrphome as i was just reading a file about insulating farm buildings. It rated concrete as a good conductor of heat obviously, which for cooling isnt so great. To stop water infiltration polystyrene is a good insulator as well as protecting agent in between a double block wall in the cavity or as described as a separate block itself. This should enable a massive reduction in heat transfer as itsa poor conductor as well as a sound and water barrier.

    It achieves good values when coupled with concrete or by itself.

    I am also looking at a building system in South Africa that combines polystyrene but havent quite uncovered what its about, but apparently local unskilled workers were used and so by some peoples thinking thai's would be able to cope with.

  13. #13
    Thailand Expat
    DrAndy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Last Online
    25-03-2014 @ 05:29 PM
    Location
    yes
    Posts
    32,028
    Beco makes them

    The Beco WALLFORM System

  14. #14
    Thailand Expat

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Last Online
    17-07-2018 @ 10:23 AM
    Location
    chiangmai - bangkok
    Posts
    1,110
    The beco system is smething i would consider depending on the cost, apparently in NZ they have a cast technology with metal bridges that are able to pour upto 3 meters each pour. This saves mess and time for construction.

    Though labour isnt as costly, it can still reduce construction time and money in that respects. I have no idea about costs but hope t contact them soon to find out.

    For me using a form that you pay for that has some function in the build makes economical sense considering it should allow cooler inside temps, and the ability for any A/C unit to work more effeciently due to a better building envelope seal( apart from that needed for hot air escape through ventilation). This inturn pys for itself rather then using wood forms, that are a waste product and cost to the build.


    All in all I would prefer to use the block bricks(shown above) and a cavity using a bond similar if possible to the rat trap bond to stop pests. Although a polystyrene bat or similar in the cavity with a water proofing cover would also be as sufficient.

    Has anyone used this type or other insulatin in walls?

    Has anyne had a cavity put in and found problems with this?

    Though alot use concrete pour post beam, i will not want build this way. Can anyne suggest the next best method, i will be building 3-4 stories high but not very wide.

    Thanks for your info so far chaps!

  15. #15
    Thailand Expat

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Last Online
    17-07-2018 @ 10:23 AM
    Location
    chiangmai - bangkok
    Posts
    1,110
    Tis i also found interesting about the BECO system taken from there website;
    Did you know...
    ...that inside the finished WALLFORM structure, the internal finishes, either wet plaster or dry linings, are applied direct onto the polystyrene face of the wall, and as a result are kept warmer.

    This means that in all rooms including bathrooms and kitchens where air humidity is high, internal surface condensation is eliminated, helping the interior decoration to last longer and stay mould-free.


    These product seems to be ticking all the right boxes so far, anyone got anything critical to say about it (apart from its probably not availible here directly)?

  16. #16
    Thailand Expat
    DrAndy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Last Online
    25-03-2014 @ 05:29 PM
    Location
    yes
    Posts
    32,028
    If not available, you could import a part container load yourself! but that does put the cost up, obviously

  17. #17
    Thailand Expat

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Last Online
    17-07-2018 @ 10:23 AM
    Location
    chiangmai - bangkok
    Posts
    1,110
    Yes i have been considering a cargo ship for other reasons so this could be possible!

    I know that other people are interested in this method of building in Thailand, as i have read posts to that tune. As per usual there is a lot of misconception and misunderstood information being thrown around, i suppose its there loss.

    If they want to keep singing from the same old not as efficient song book as the rest of us that dont bother me. Why are so many people hell bent on protecting concrete building and post and beam work even if by trade they still make out that icf isn't as good?????

    To me i see a place for it and sometimes you can achieve nice results but in the whole it leaves little architectural merit and integrity or even just something nice and different to look at!!!!!!!

    ICF building has something of interest for places like Thailand, as it gives designers and builders an option to create something original or different simple or complex.

    I dont care too much for concrete but in my current project thats what i must use, however i must find something other then post beam concrete pour. If there is an interest maybe i should look into Beco's distribution offer?

    polystyrene is the new wood and concrete fill is the new well concrete!

    Any comments regarding the above caps?

  18. #18
    Thailand Expat
    DrAndy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Last Online
    25-03-2014 @ 05:29 PM
    Location
    yes
    Posts
    32,028
    Quote Originally Posted by benlovesnuk
    Why are so many people hell bent on protecting concrete building and post and beam work
    because it is easy and cheap and flexible, and the local builders can do it

    as in any country, if you start using unfamiliar materials, you tend to get more headaches

  19. #19
    Thailand Expat
    splitlid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Last Online
    Today @ 03:27 AM
    Posts
    1,044
    Quote Originally Posted by benlovesnuk View Post
    Yes i have been considering a cargo ship for other reasons so this could be possible!

    I know that other people are interested in this method of building in Thailand, as i have read posts to that tune. As per usual there is a lot of misconception and misunderstood information being thrown around, i suppose its there loss.

    If they want to keep singing from the same old not as efficient song book as the rest of us that dont bother me. Why are so many people hell bent on protecting concrete building and post and beam work even if by trade they still make out that icf isn't as good?????

    To me i see a place for it and sometimes you can achieve nice results but in the whole it leaves little architectural merit and integrity or even just something nice and different to look at!!!!!!!

    ICF building has something of interest for places like Thailand, as it gives designers and builders an option to create something original or different simple or complex.

    I dont care too much for concrete but in my current project thats what i must use, however i must find something other then post beam concrete pour. If there is an interest maybe i should look into Beco's distribution offer?

    polystyrene is the new wood and concrete fill is the new well concrete!

    Any comments regarding the above caps?


    i cant see how using ICF can give you better architecture?this is usually the architect that designs stuff,and his ability,sight,imagination, should not be hindered by basic construction materials and construction methods.
    can you provide examples of what can be achieved, and why it cant be achieved using present construction method.
    cheers

  20. #20
    Thailand Expat
    DrAndy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Last Online
    25-03-2014 @ 05:29 PM
    Location
    yes
    Posts
    32,028
    Quote Originally Posted by splitlid
    i cant see how using ICF can give you better architecture?this is usually the architect that designs stuff,and his ability,sight,imagination, should not be hindered by basic construction materials and construction methods.
    I think a good architect either chooses his materials to suit the type of building required, or he designs the building with the materials in mind

    construction materials can radically alter any building if you wish

    like using steel can give you structures that cannot be achieved with concrete pillars and beams

    mind you, I am not sure what the polystyrene blocks can do that is different, besides not having columns getting in the way

  21. #21
    Thailand Expat

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Last Online
    17-07-2018 @ 10:23 AM
    Location
    chiangmai - bangkok
    Posts
    1,110
    Ok then, I understand your points of view and can answer them from an opinion and process that is solely of my own.

    Firstly, I think post and bem concrete pour is exatcly what an architect would use to create something that is technically sound for builders in this country. This method is widely used and though i can create variation in its method in my opinion this method of building has way to many limitations.

    This could be seen in space, cooling , cost and design.

    It seems funny to me that people say as a genral statement that post and beam is where its at, this to me sounds like you have settled for what you consider to me to be a less hassle option, based solely on what contruction workers are capable of(forgive me if i am wrong im sure that you all will put me right)?

    Im not attacking those that use it and i dont care to say that one thing is better then the other as I dont gain anything from it and most will say the the oppposite. But for me post and beam inhibits alot of factors in my mind, and regardless of how inven tive the arhcitect is he has to work from something you give him as a place you want to live in.

    For this reason having a reasonable competant understanding yourself of materials and design will feed the architects ability to pull it all together, which i am not capable of doing my self!

    Im sure whlst an architect has the abilty to do what he wants and choose accordingly, i would say that many or most here will go with what they know and that is NOT what i want. Im not trying to break the mold and achieve something different from others, however i do see the capabilty of doing something;

    A) much better for the same cost in terms of design, cooling, functionality and aesthetic merits all relvant to their cost.

    B) Or if possible cheaper and more cost effective that as near as possible best suits those above.

    I dont mean to sound rude or snipe but its tiring to listen to rhetoric about building what is and more to the many what is NOT possible!

    Especially from the few i think that have a a greater understanding from me on these things and that have an incredible amount more practical knowledge. In tis is suppose my naivity is a good thing and to tis im sure that people will make the point that is why i seem overly confident about doing something different then what most tend to settle for.

    But lets take a minute to look over what ive said which is theoretical for us all as i presume we all havent used this building technique;

    1) It isnt complicated to build with and is expressly commented on that a few hours of onsite training can make complete novices to building as awole confident to lay the block work. This is genrally snapped in place like lego, its lightweight and construction is much faster then most other building methods.

    2) It intergrates an insulation material into the framework creating a strong, effecient building that has more effetive use them most other materials at the cost level(taken from a uk perspetive or even australain and new zealand costing).

    3) It suits the hot humid climate we live in unlike concrete(solely on its own) and is a modern way of combining the ease of use and solid construction concrete gives with less waste and typically less concrete.

    4) No other material that i have investigated for building has the cost, design, and ease of construction as this method specualtes it has. Also offsetting the fact that is has a greater effeciency to cut down bills and because of the dynamics of the material means it has te best comprised ratio i have seen for what i want as stated above in acheiving better results all round.

    As its not even probably availible in Thailand at this moment i concede the cost is unknown and undesirable at the moment, but also to swing the other way it could be just as expensive as concrete post beam and yet a much better material for construction, building effeciency and so gives it a more desirable factor.

    im not trying to win people over i dont sell it (yet) and have no interest in trying to turn others as it doesnt benefit to do so, if people can see some reason amongst the madness then that is fine please discuss more. If people are going to make the same points about post and beam, thank you for your thoughts but dont waste your time on this thread, I am not interested in this building method!

    so any more to add?

    Im still waiting for anyones thoughts on the block brick building at the very top, tis construction seems to be something different that i havent seen talked about or used on this thread. It as many merits including cost, load bearing walls that use an air gap to cool (or at least act more effeciently then concrete pour or brick infill) anyone got comments?

    thanks once again!

  22. #22
    Thailand Expat
    splitlid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Last Online
    Today @ 03:27 AM
    Posts
    1,044
    ben your ideas are great and your enthuasium is to be applauded, but before you get too carried away with you new construction methods to be used here in thailand, you really should speak to some one at your local govt who will be able to inform you of the basic building codes here in thailand,
    one of them is i believe that columns and beams must be used.

  23. #23
    Thailand Expat
    Marmite the Dog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Last Online
    08-09-2014 @ 10:43 AM
    Location
    Simian Islands
    Posts
    34,827
    I know a company that uses metal formers to pour concrete walls in Thailand, but unless you want to build a few hundred homes at a time they won't be interested.

  24. #24
    Thailand Expat

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Last Online
    17-07-2018 @ 10:23 AM
    Location
    chiangmai - bangkok
    Posts
    1,110
    Thank you for your quick responses concerning the thread.

    I didnt realise that there was only literally one method to which you could construct a building just different styles?

    I think that some places have allowed monolithic structures like adobe walls as bricks as far as i can gather, there is no pillar column system, though i am not 100%........????

    Surely you could consider that one long wall of concrete is a post on which beams would be laid or am i opening a can of worms here?

    I know that a wealthy businesswoman well connected in Thailand is looking at this system in Australia and New zealand, so maybe there will be a change in this instance?

    However to clarify what we are suggesting at the moment that post and beam must be allocated in the building as a load bearing system?

    I know for instance that the superbloc website thaialnd suggests that there is no need for post and beam in building with superbloc as they can be connected at corners but obviously this is by no means clarification on the building code but thought an interesting point to observe.

    Is there someone that can explain tis point further to specific guidelines or are you going to make me do some work and go to the government offices?

    One last point I have heard that steel is expensive to use and contruct a building with(only commercial outlets use it) is this typically true?

    thanks once again to your replies!

  25. #25
    Thailand Expat
    DrAndy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Last Online
    25-03-2014 @ 05:29 PM
    Location
    yes
    Posts
    32,028
    Quote Originally Posted by benlovesnuk
    Im sure whlst an architect has the abilty to do what he wants and choose accordingly, i would say that many or most here will go with what they know and that is NOT what i want.
    There is your problem,finding an architect who wants to use the block method

    Quote Originally Posted by benlovesnuk
    I dont mean to sound rude or snipe but its tiring to listen to rhetoric about building what is and more to the many what is NOT possible!
    I have not noticed any rhetoric, merely advice based on knowledge

    Quote Originally Posted by benlovesnuk
    It isnt complicated to build with and is expressly commented on that a few hours of onsite training can make complete novices to building as awole confident to lay the block work. This is genrally snapped in place like lego, its lightweight and construction is much faster then most other building methods.
    Partly true, however, that is only for the walls. You still need foundations and those would be columns and beams, or do you have better methods

    Quote Originally Posted by benlovesnuk
    No other material that i have investigated for building has the cost, design, and ease of construction as this method specualtes it has
    Quote Originally Posted by benlovesnuk
    As its not even probably availible in Thailand at this moment i concede the cost is unknown
    those above two statements are contradictory. From previous posts it seems that you did not know about this method until it was mentioned in our rhetoric! now you espouse it with a fervour. Do more research maybe

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •