Thread: Mud, bamboo and alternative building materials

I would like to learn more about building with mud. It's use is common throughout South Asia, but not in SEA. Although there are some ppl in Northern Thailand building with it and a group was running a building course in Chiang Rai a few years ago.

Can anyone think of reasons why mud is not suitable for Thailand? I've read that it's more suited to tropical conditions than concrete, as it doesn't heat up so much.

Building material prices have been rising rapidly. As costs increase so called 'alternative' and 'green' building products become more feasible, because they are renewable and can often be found locally.

Mud is a good example of this. If you dig a pond/damn on your property, you will have a lot of mud. This can either be made into bricks or rendered over a bamboo frame. The result can be painted and will look pretty much the same as concrete.

Any thoughts?

Originally Posted by Smithson

I would like to learn more about building with mud. It's use is common throughout South Asia, but not in SEA. Although there are some ppl in Northern Thailand building with it and a group was running a building course in Chiang Rai a few years ago.

Can anyone think of reasons why mud is not suitable for Thailand? I've read that it's more suited to tropical conditions than concrete, as it doesn't heat up so much.

Building material prices have been rising rapidly. As costs increase so called 'alternative' and 'green' building products become more feasible, because they are renewable and can often be found locally.

Mud is a good example of this. If you dig a pond/damn on your property, you will have a lot of mud. This can either be made into bricks or rendered over a bamboo frame. The result can be painted and will look pretty much the same as concrete.

Any thoughts?

may be worth looking into

my mud is very sticky clay and would make a great building material

come round and help yourself

[at]Smithson
You should ask there coolthaihouse.com • Index page

regards
Lothar

Originally Posted by benlovesnuk

doctor doctor give me the news......... i got a bad case of needing your mud....!!!!!????? Dr A how much mud are we talking about???????

bring your bucket and spade Ben

if you need a lot, we had it delivered in lorry loads of 5 cu.m. for B400 a load

I think i might be fine, but its always good to have a back up plan.......

sorry im stupid you said a load 400B, and a load being 5 cu.m or not?

you should check the consistency of your subsoil, if you dont know already;

clear topsoil dirt and when you hit the clay soil take a handfull, put in a jar and fill upto almost full with water, shake and leave after a certain time (it can be upto 6 days) you will have a clear breakdown of percentages of materials in your dirt this can show you what percentage you would need to make good cob, with 20- 30 % being clay then the rest being built up aggregate to smaller sand pieces.

you can then use to build with and as its on your land materials cost nothing it is of course labour intensive, but you can use diggers to mix big loads, and implement each lift (rise of wall).

Im sure you know already!

Thanks for the info, I've seen that group up North, interesting work, just a little too far from me.

I'm very interested in a technique using bamboo strips on the wall and then applying mud to the bamboo. It's common in Columbia where it's known as Bahareque.

Have you seen this before?

you mean to build walls? or to build internal walls?

Most would use bamboo for structure just as you would use wood, it just cheaper! Remember you to treat the bamboo, and concrete the ends to stop turmites eating it!!!!!! You can then choose to not fill the walls, fills the walls with a bamboo wall sheet (though most are synthetic) or use mud as you with bamboo to create a strong wall structure. I live in bangkok currently if you can get to there i can meet you and discuss with you your options!!!!!

these are just a few.....

Originally Posted by benlovesnuk

I think i might be fine, but its always good to have a back up plan.......

sorry im stupid you said a load 400B, and a load being 5 cu.m or not?

yes, a lorry load is 5 cu.m. and costs B400 delivered (by lorry)

It's called adobe isn't it.

One of my Irish mates is passionate about adobe buildings. He buys books on it which he finds fascinating.

Adobe is not 'armed' with a structre, as you would arm concrete. Earth is packed between 'solid' columns, like stones, trees. You can improve your soil structure by mixing it up with straw (rice, grass...), or anything with long and tough fibers. I wonder wether hemp has ever been tested this way.

Imo, termites would be a good enough reason not to build with bamboos inside soil in SEA, right ? Unless you build on concrete stilts !

++ ^^

^ When building with bamboo you must not have it come into contact with the ground or any areas that may get wet. Termites aren't such a problem, other borer insects are worse. Bamboo needs to be carefully selected and then treated with preservatives, such as boron. It's difficult to say just how long treated bamboo would last in tropical Thailand, there is so little info available. Amazing stuff has been done in Columbia, including bridges with 60m spans.

> I've read that it's more suited to tropical conditions than concrete,
> as it doesn't heat up so much.

That sort of implies that houses in Thailand are made out of concrete; typically only the posts & beams are concrete, but the walls aren't. You can use heat insulating building materials for the walls.

Is there a link to some pics that show what these houses typically look like? I'm imagining MASSIVE walls, and a shape that looks okay as an exhibit, but not to actually live in?

Building adobe homes, rammed earth, green building, adobe houses, and passive solar homes

Originally Posted by WhiteLotusLane

> I've read that it's more suited to tropical conditions than concrete,
> as it doesn't heat up so much.

That sort of implies that houses in Thailand are made out of concrete; typically only the posts & beams are concrete, but the walls aren't. You can use heat insulating building materials for the walls.

Is there a link to some pics that show what these houses typically look like? I'm imagining MASSIVE walls, and a shape that looks okay as an exhibit, but not to actually live in?

The walls may be brick, but both breezeblocks and superblocks are made from cement.

Sure you can use heat insulating materials, but these are probably more expensive and definitely less sustainable than mud and bamboo.

I've seen pics of some pretty amazing bamboo structures, but thought I'd post a few that seemed to be more like normal houses. The show it being used with mud, as well as a kit home in Hawaii (the houses are actually made in Vietnam).

Hi all, been following construction thread here with interest, I have land in Phetchabun on which I want to build using techniques other than concrete posts and blocks. I recently came accross Hydraform dry stacking of an interlocking mud brick. This is formed from local soil, with a binder and , apart from the foundations, needs no mortar.
I am in touch with the manufacturers of the machines, a bit pricey, and there is a company in Bangkok , Yamsorn Engineering, who use this technique, but have not answered my emails.
Does anyone have any knowledge of this technique, availability of the machines to rent in Thailand, or any thoughts on the use of this system here?
PP

Hi - How much was the press? Is it a Cinva Ram? There's a company in Samut Prakan that sells Cinva Rams (INTERLOCKING BLOCK), which may be of interest. I looked into the this but decided against CEBs (compressed earth block) since quality control is much more of an issue than when making regular adobes; with CEBs, I think (but may be wrong), moisture levels in your mix need to carefully monitored but with adobes it's pretty hard to go wrong. I don't think there's any reason why CEBs would be a problem here - they use them a lot at Auroville in southern India (and have built some very impressive vaulted structures). Do a search for them - they have some useful information on their website. I'm going to build an adobe house up near Lampang. At the moment I'm getting my hand in with an oversized adobe garden shed to see how things work out. It's f*cking hard work but it's fun. If you want any advice on regular adobe, I may be able to help (I'm learning as I go but it's not exactly Astro-Physics).

Hi , just checked out the Cinva site..thanks. The Hydraform is very similar, different shape interlocking block, their cheapest press is $16k, then you need grinders, mixers and other sundries, so not cheap. However they do seem to produce a consistant block, testable , and have done large projects (Phillippines, for one).

I will have to find out the differences in quality, if any between the two, google Hydraform and check them out. If I went that way I would set up a biz here in LOS using my build as a showcase and hope to recoup the investment in the presses by renting out or helping with other builds. Have to do cost comparisons etc yet.

The adobe sounds great, I can see a variety of structures appearing on my land as I try out different stuff, but the idea of making my own blocks really appeals.

Check out:
(Thai Navy to build adobe training center)Thai Navy to build adobe training center
dirtydog .

Thread goes nowhere as I remember, but you might get a lead. Please post something if you find anything. My experience with adobe is it's great.

Good Luck.

I saw these machines at a sufficiency economy project in Nakhon Nayok, they also had adobe buildings. The bricks looked really strong and I've noticed them used in some building around NN. The pic is below, apparently the machine for grinding is called a 'hammer mill' and has many uses, especially in agriculture.

^ I've noticed the CEB in a few buildings, but only while driving past. There was one restaurant that was quite nice (although the food was shite). I'll keep my eye out for more and take a closer look.

The place with the machine had pics of some very nice building, not hippie huts at all. They also have some adobe bungalows, I've been meaning to go back and see if there's any cracks due to the dry weather. They were using rice husks and 'termite dirt'. Getting clear info from the ppl at the place is really difficult.

Dan, why don't you start a thread about your project?

Prestburypark: I had a look again at the Auroville website and remembered that they also sell their own CEB-making equipment (see Auroville Earth Institute, Auram press 3000, Auram blocks, Auram equipment, Auram earth construction equipment.), so that might be another one for you to follow up. Importing from India to Thailand would, I'm sure, be the nightmare to end all nightmares but they've obviously got experience of building for tropical climates. Some of the stuff they've built with CEBs is pretty impressive:



and



Smithson: Yea, I should start a thread. There's been a few posts about earth building here so it'd be good to see one in progress. The problem is that it's just me, part-time, so progress is limited.

I think one hurdle would be how cheap those little red blocks (that are currently used) are. Regardless sustainable or cool your adobe blocks are in order to sell them to the local populace the price would have to be extremely low.

Other than that I love the idea. I lived in an adobe house for a few years and think it's a great building material.


Oh yeah, that ampitheater is gorgeous.