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  1. #376
    Member Thai Dhupp's Avatar
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    While i was back in Thailand for 2.5 weeks, after the airport construction contract came to an end, we met with, interviewed and checked out ,and ultimately rejected all but 1 of 7 builder possibilities. Hugely differing levels of interest, of course wild variations in the prices (!), with one confidently stating that it could not be done for less than 20M - I think he had been out in the sun too long (rejected of course)

    It came down to 2 - one had a lot of temple building experience which i thought might be a good option for the roof requirements, both were experienced in creating the wood look using mortar (we saw samples of both their work and it was excellent), the second one was cheaper and available and had his own piling equipment, so we did not need the external piling contractor + plus that meant he was 100% responsible for 100% of the build. he was also based nearer to the project site.

    so... builder no.2...come on down.. the price is right! (oh...and you some work to do)

  2. #377
    Member Thai Dhupp's Avatar
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    when will it all start, i think i heard asked (!)?

    OK...if you look back at earlier posts i always said... not til December time at the earliest. We wanted the raised ground to settle as much as possible and also the rains to finish for the year. also... as mentioned...I'm not there. so its still looking like end of the year to start the works.

  3. #378
    Member Thai Dhupp's Avatar
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    OK...here i am asking questions again!

    we are now near to engaging the 'chosen one', and so the subject of contracts has raised its head.

    What to put in? What is absolutely essential? How to stage the payments? Penalties? etc,etc...

    I have already had one sample contract from Norton (thanks for it!) which was v useful and so i wanted to ask the rest of you what experiences you had with drafting contracts, what you maybe wished you had included, what is not important, and so on.

    All replies gratefully received on what is I think an important part of the build?
    Last edited by Thai Dhupp; 08-11-2017 at 04:12 PM.

  4. #379
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    My contract was in Thai, but we thrashed out the agreement verbally first, and then was assured by the missus that the content was correct when it came to signing (she is pretty good at this sort of thing). What I would say from my experience is to insist that the foreman/builder has a notebook on-site with him at all times, and any direction/request/point of note/complaint/error in construction etc should be entered, dated and signed for.

    I made several requests at numerous times during my build for some features to be included and these multiple requests were accepted and agreed and then promptly ignored, only after my constant badgering and at a very late stage in the build were then actioned, but by then the end results weren't as expected as the features were not put in at the correct time during the construction process. Being informal works for some things, but not for others... If I had insisted that the procedure was a bit more formal by using a report book, then the build would have gone much smoother.

    Payments were made in instalments, 20% deposit and for foundations and footings , 20% for concrete work for house base, 20% for steelwork, roofing and walls, 20% for tiling, windows, doors and interiors...10% for wiring and plumbing and fittings etc. The final payment of 10% was withheld for one month as security against any possible major fixes that needed doing (but I'd suggest making this 20% withheld for 2-3 months with your build as it's more complicated and extensive than mine was).

    I don't think insisting on a penalty clause for late completion will work outside of Bangkok, or if building a large resort somewhere, it's more relevant to commercial builds... Inclusion of a penalty clause might just force the team to panic and start taking shortcuts with the build (which will happen to some extent anyway, so no need to make matters worse!). Additionally, I think inclusion of a penalty may result in an unfinished build. Despite what may be agreed at the beginning, if the builder suspects he's going to face financial difficulty because of some arbitrary deadline he's definitely going to overshoot (I'd allow 15% extra time on what is agreed), he'll just abandon the build at 80%. Then you'll be faced with trying to find another team to finish off the work when most of the funds (and thus profit) have been used up. This can (and does) happen very often all over the world.

  5. #380
    Member Thai Dhupp's Avatar
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    That all good advice Jonny - thanks for jumping with a reply so swiftly!

    I tend to agree about the penalty clause too. given that deadlines do'slip' ...no point in over-pressurising the situation.

    Holding the last 15 or 20% like you suggested, is a sort of penalty to complete at around the agreed time and to a standard anyway - no need to load it up any more I think.

    Others might have a different take on it though...?

    Thanks again.

  6. #381
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    Just make sure the 15-20% withheld is withheld for x amount of time after provisional sign-off, not for x amount of time from agreed deadline.

  7. #382
    Member Thai Dhupp's Avatar
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    Good point Maanaam and one that, I'm sure is easily overlooked.

    Thanks for the input

  8. #383
    Days Work Done! Norton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonnyenglish View Post
    20% deposit and for foundations and footings , 20% for concrete work for house base, 20% for steelwork, roofing and walls, 20% for tiling, windows, doors and interiors...10% for wiring and plumbing and fittings etc. The final payment of 10% was withheld for one month as security against any possible major fixes that needed doing
    Pretty much standard.

    Make sure the house plans are referenced as the build to requirements and attached as part of the contract.

    House plans need to go into detail on all materials. Specifics on cement, steel, flooring, electrics, plumbing and fixtures. I even had manufacturer and model numbers for near all fixtures.

    Will take some work but if ysou cost out the materials and make a SWAG on labor you will get a good should cost. I did this for my house and added 20% profit for the builder.

    Hard to be definitive on workmanship and quality so as I mentioned earlier, go look at previous builds the builder did. That's what you will get.
    Last edited by Norton; 09-11-2017 at 05:06 PM.
    Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.

  9. #384
    Days Work Done! Norton's Avatar
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    One more I forgot. Contract clause that says the builder is responsible for removing all building debris from the property.

  10. #385
    Thailand Expat HuangLao's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Norton View Post
    One more I forgot. Contract clause that says the builder is responsible for removing all building debris from the property.
    Most assuredly.
    As this character is built into Thai DNA. Leaving a mess and allowing most everything to lie about without consciousness of responsibility thereof.

    Imperative that such firm agreements are adhered to or they'll just let it go.
    Preferably, cleaning and removing as they go - instead of when job is finished.

  11. #386
    Member Thai Dhupp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Norton View Post
    Pretty much standard.

    Make sure the house plans are referenced as the build to requirements and attached as part of the contract.

    House plans need to go into detail on all materials. Specifics on cement, steel, flooring, electrics, plumbing and fixtures. I even had manufacturer and model numbers for near all fixtures.

    Will take some work but if ysou cost out the materials and make a SWAG on labor you will get a good should cost. I did this for my house and added 20% profit for the builder.

    Hard to be definitive on workmanship and quality so as I mentioned earlier, go look at previous builds the builder did. That's what you will get.
    Good advice as always, Norton... we saw the quality of the two shortlisted candidates, both good. I have confidence in our final selection ...time will tell.

    Yeah... I started thinking about including specifics too for the key items and methods in the document, but some smaller requirements too. (the floor tile design and colour in the lower entrance is one such). As you said, takes time but makes it clear to everyone so definitely worth it as long as they then follow what's agreed!.

    Thanks for the contribution.

  12. #387
    Member Thai Dhupp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Norton View Post
    One more I forgot. Contract clause that says the builder is responsible for removing all building debris from the property.
    Quote Originally Posted by HuangLao View Post
    Most assuredly.
    As this character is built into Thai DNA. Leaving a mess and allowing most everything to lie about without consciousness of responsibility thereof.

    Imperative that such firm agreements are adhered to or they'll just let it go.
    Preferably, cleaning and removing as they go - instead of when job is finished.
    Well...I'm a firm believer in 'a little and often', but let's not talk about that...

    ...instead, 'clean up as you go' -most definitely!! Norton and HuangLao... another important inclusion and again maybe one that gets forgotten in the excitement of 'building the dream'... thanks guys!

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