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  1. #1
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    Water Filter -- Whole House

    I have thoroughly researched non-chemical removal of manganese from water with a ph of 7.1.

    What I need for a filter media is mined manganese dioxide, often sold in the West under the tradenames, Pro-OX™, Pyrolox™, Filox™, and MangOx™. These are granules of solid manganese dioxide.

    Manganese "greensand" is not the same. Its granules are only coated with a thin layer of manganese oxide and it needs periodic chemical regeneration with potassium permanganate, where the mined manganese dioxide does not. Birm does not need regeneration and works great for iron removal at a ph of 7.1, but for manganese, the ph would have to be raised to 8.5-9.

    Everybody in every shop I have gone into purports to know everything about water filtration, but upon questioning, it quickly becomes apparent that they do not know anything at all about water chemistry. It has been very frustrating.

    In all the filtering shops they say, "We have 'manganese,' this one right here." Manganese what? It sure as shit is not elemental manganese. Is it manganese dioxide? Is it manganese greeensand? The labels are inconclusive. They never heard of chemical regeneration or potassium permanganate. Mention of these things gets only blank stares. Yet manganese greensand will stop working after about only a month without chemical regeneration, despite their claims that it's good for three years. What are these people selling?

    I am located in Phitsanulok, but that's irrelevant. does anybody know where to purchase mined solid manganese dioxide ANYWHERE in Thailand, preferably under one of the the trade names mentioned above?

  2. #2
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    Ratchaburi's Avatar
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    TT Welcome to TD

    I will ask a suppier that I know today & let you know.
    If Manganese Dioxide would you like some salt to.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ratchaburi View Post
    TT Welcome to TD

    I will ask a suppier that I know today & let you know.
    If Manganese Dioxide would you like some salt to.
    Thanks!

    Salt?

  4. #4
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    TT

    NIC InterChem Company Limited

    26/26 Moo 4 Suksawat rd Jomthong Bangkok

    Mobile 0867812907

    Manganese Dioxide;MnO 2

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ratchaburi View Post
    TT

    NIC InterChem Company Limited

    26/26 Moo 4 Suksawat rd Jomthong Bangkok

    Mobile 0867812907

    Manganese Dioxide;MnO 2
    Wow! Thanks for that information, Ratchaburi!

  6. #6
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    TT if you have a problem getting it let me know.

  7. #7
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    Manganese in water supply

    Ratchaburi I tried to PM you but was restricted from doing so since I have fewer than 20 posts. I wanted to personally introduce myself and thank you for your generous help. Maybe somebody else will find the following useful. Most of the PM is below:

    You said: "TT if you have a problem getting it let me know."

    Thank you, I will. I have been agonizing for quite some time over putting together the proper point of entry house water filter. I get water from my village water supply (small village in Phitsanulok), which comes from a well. Nobody seems to know how deep it is.

    I am building a house across the road from where I now live. The ONLY issue that concerns me about the water is the manganese. I have had it tested and the water is completely potable and clean. They have a big aeration unit and a big sand filter at the village supply. As you probably know, manganese in well water is clear, not a problem and fairly stable -- until it gets oxidized. Then it forms a black manganese dioxide precipitate. Of course, when they aerate it, the process begins and it is too slow a reaction for their sand filter to catch all the precipitate before it forms, so off it goes into the pipes with the precipitate continuing to form.

    In the house I am in (in-laws), there is no tank and no pump. So the water simply flows from the water supply at a fairly low pressure (the incoming PVC pipes are not even glued). As the manganese dioxide continues to precipitate, it literally plugs up all the slow running pipes. They have to be knocked with a hammer to shake it loose or taken apart and reamed out with a steel rod about every six months, or the water is blocked by the black precipitated manganese dioxide plugging the pipes.

    In the house I am building, I did all the plumbing and electrical myself -- to western standards. When finished, I will have a tank and pump for the house and do not want this black sludge entering the house pipes. In fact, with a high pressure pump and all my PVC pipes glued, having them plugged up with this precipitate would be nothing less than a disaster.

    I have been frustrated dealing with the "water experts" in this country because they do not seem to know a single thing about water chemistry; they simply repeat what they have been told like parrots. They have a filter media they call "manganese," and that's all they know about it. Of course it is not manganese, which is a brittle gray metal not found in its elemental form. If I ask, "Is it manganese greensand? Is it manganese dioxide? What is it?" I draw blank stares. The sacks reveal nothing.

    I have done considerable research. Birm was a possibility, but it is not effective with manganese at a water ph below about 8.5 and mine is 7.1. I could run the water through a bed of calcite to raise the ph, but that creates the potential of mineralization problems at showerheads, etc.; a problem we do not have with the water as it is.

    Another possibility is manganese greensand, which has a thin coating of manganese oxide on it that acts as a catalyst to hasten the formation of manganese dioxide which is then caught in the filter bed. But it has to be regenerated with an oxidant like potassium permanganate (toxic) as often as every two weeks to every month depending on the amount of manganese -- or it stops working (ditto for manganese Zeolite). Number one, I don't want to be bothered with constant regeneration. Number two, I have yet to find a Thai "water expert" that knows anything at all about regeneration and the mention of potassium permanganate again draws blank stares -- they certainly don't offer it. They say their "manganese" will take manganese out of the water and will last for three years, but they don't even know what it is they are selling!

    So my research has finally led me to naturally mined manganese dioxide as a filter bed media. It does not require regeneration and will last for several years -- if adequately backwashed. The downside is that manganese dioxide is VERY heavy and requires a large volume of water at a good flow rate to adequately backwash it. If not adequately backwashed, it will plug up with the precipitate. I can use a large diameter pipe to carry the backwash water to gardens, trees, etc. The larger diameter should avoid the plugging up problem, especially with a good strong flow.

    As with all catalytic methods of manganese removal, the water must be adequately oxidized. Although it is aerated at the source, it may not be enough. Rather than do it chemically (chlorine, etc.), I will aerate the water as it enters a smaller tank from the water supply using a venturi type aeration device. The small tank will allow the oxidation some time to take place. I will then pump it, using a small pump, from the small tank through another venturi aeration device, and then through the manganese dioxide bed filter and on into the large storage tank, which I HOPE will be free of the manganese dioxide precipitate. Then a larger pump will take the water into the house. I do not have huge concentration of manganese, it is fairly moderate but obnoxious, so I hope this will solve the problem. I also have a little iron, not not an intolerable amount, but enough to taste, and the manganese dioxide filter should take care of that as well.

    All things considered, this seems the best way to eliminate this nasty black precipitate from entering my house, where it can foul pipes, water heaters, washing machines, etc.

    I want an auto-backwash filter, as I am trying to make this system as low maintenance as possible. I am leaning towards the Master A Series A2 filter. I do not need a cartridge filter inline, nor do I need the water softened as calcium carbonates are already well within acceptable limits.

    What to you think? I'll post this on the forum as well, as somebody may find it useful.

    For anyone building, I have collected a wealth of information about electrical issues and components, where to get a deal on sectional overhead garage doors with remote openers, and a bunch more, etc. Let me know if I can help you!

  8. #8
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    Why don't you just put a reverse osmosis filter in?

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Necron99 View Post
    Why don't you just put a reverse osmosis filter in?
    Much too slow for a whole house filter. It is not just drinking water, its washing water, cooking water, bath water toilet water, refrigerator water, etc. All the water entering the house.

  10. #10
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    TongueTaied or TT for a short name

    I would have 1 tank & 1 pump.
    Large tank drop the water from the top of the tank.
    Then a pressure pump with the water going though how many filter you would like to use Manganese Dioxide & Resin for the Iron
    Carbon filter would take the colour & oder out of the water.
    You need to have a good flow of water to backwash your filter

    I don't know about Chemical, but multi media filter may do the job.

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