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  1. #1
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    Legionella and water tanks ?

    Can anyone tell me how this works in Thailand ?

    We are gonna build a small house in Thailand this year and even if when I am retired we will only occasionally live in this property .

    Now it has occured to me that water stored in our tank from the well is gonna be sitting there sometimes for a longish period ,, in your experience ( as I have none ) is this going to be a problem breeding ground for legionella ?

    I believe its doormant below 20 C not sure what temp you have to achieve to kill it off ?

    Does anyone have any ideas / tips ?
    I'm proud of my 38" waist , also proud I have never done drugs

  2. #2
    TD Fat Club VP Dillinger's Avatar
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    I reckon chlorine must kill it Nige, judging by the stench of the water in all the pads that I lived in, in Thailand

  3. #3
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    Is that what they use ?

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    TD Fat Club VP Dillinger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nigelandjan
    it has occured to me that water stored in our tank from the well is gonna be sitting there sometimes for a longish period
    Make sure you run your taps for a while before sticking the plug in and squeezing in the bath mate. Also all the other taps in the house, especially the shower, oh.... and even more impotantly ....the bum gun

  5. #5
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    legionella should not be a problem, if the water is below 25C

    if your water is hotter than that (in an above ground tank) you can use

    Chlorine dioxide

    Chlorine dioxide has been EPA approved as a primary potable water disinfectant since 1945. It does not produce any carcinogenic byproducts like chlorine and is not a restricted heavy metal like copper. It has proven excellent control of Legionella in cold and hot water systems and its ability as a biocide is not impacted by pH, or any water corrosion inhibitors like silica or phosphate. Monochloramine is an alternative. Like chlorine and chlorine dioxide, monochloramine is EPA approved as a primary potable water disinfectant.


    to clean the water before use. Just chuck the recommended amount into your tank
    I have reported your post

  6. #6
    TD Fat Club VP Dillinger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nigelandjan
    Is that what they use ?
    I would surely think so.

    Sustained elimination of Legionella in potable water systems is only possible when combined with combating biofilm in pipes.





    Biofilms are layers of microorganisms and extra cellular substances. These, often slimy or fungal-type layers, are inhabited by Legionella bacteria, which multiply well in this environment. The main problem: biofilms are extremely resistant to disinfectants. For this reason, Legionella bacteria prove themselves to be extremely resistant to common disinfecting methods, since the biofilm protects them against attack from chemicals. All aimed directly at destroying Legionella alone, are therefore not permanent and do not solve the problem of Legionella.

    Chlorine dioxide is the most effective weapon that can be used in potable water for fighting biofilm, Legionella, pseudomonad's and other pathogenic bacteria simultaneously. As a gas released in water, it is able to penetrate the protective layers of slime-forming microorganisms, which leads not only to growth inhibition of biofilm, but also to its gradual removal from all pipe-work. In so doing, its main advantage is that as a disinfectant it meets the requirements of potable water regulations and so continual dosing is possible. In this way, very small concentrations can achieve freedom from Legionella in the medium term and sustain this in the long term. Unlike other disinfectants, there is no concern about resistance developing. The excellent deposit effect of Chlorine Dioxide even protects pipelines, which are not in continual use.
    ^ There you go, he will know

  7. #7
    TD Fat Club VP Dillinger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrAndy
    to clean the water before use. Just chuck the recommended amount into your tank
    How often should the chloriine dioxide be applied ?

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    Another interesting thread with some valuable info. Thanks Nigel !

    Now where does one buy Chlorine Dioxide in Thailand ?

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    I was thinking about that emptying it ,, but then again I was wondering it that was gonna make things worse ,, I have an old empty water tank in my loft at home here now since I have had a combi boiler installed and looking inside of it !!!!! it has all kinds of mutations germinating in there , bloody biological warfare going off in me loft it is

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by stevefarang View Post

    Now where does one buy Chlorine Dioxide in Thailand ?
    Whilst Dr. Andy's advice is chemically correct in that chlorine dioxide is a disinfectant. Chlorine Dioxide is a gas. It is quite nasty, unstable so usually dissolved in water for handling and is not generally available. It has to be generated on site.

    Legionella is more likely to be found in cooling towers which recirculate water at higher than ambient temperatures.

    Nigelandjan,

    Many people have water tanks do they have Legionella? Keep the tank in the shade.

    If worried use Haiter (bleach) One teaspoon will disinfect 5 gallons

    So for long-standing water in tanks 1 pint household bleach per 1000 gallons. About 300ml (a beer bottle) for each 1000l. If my math is correct. Just bung it in. If you can slightly smell chlorine it is working.
    Better to think inside the pub, than outside the box?
    I apologize if any offence was caused. unless it was intended.
    You people, you think I know feck nothing; I tell you: I know feck all
    Those who cannot change their mind, cannot change anything.

  11. #11
    TD Fat Club VP Dillinger's Avatar
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    Reading Phuket plumbing's FAQ page, you will just need to get your tank emptied and cleaned once a year and it's sodium hypochlorite(chlorine) they use to apply to the water

    FAQs

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dillinger View Post
    you will just need to get your tank emptied and cleaned once a year and it's sodium hypochlorite(chlorine) they use to apply to the water
    Yes. Otherwise known as household bleach which is usually about 5% in water.

    Pulp and Paper does pay a little less than Oil and Gas but one does learn some practical stuff.

  13. #13
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    cheeky bugger

    Chlorine Dioxide is sold in tablet form for small use, although quite expensive

    they are normally sold as water purification tablets for drinking water

    maybe your local water filter company or pool company could help?

  14. #14
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    Go to any pool shop and buy some slow release chlorine tablets that they use in pools. I have a rain capture system with two tanks. A 20,000 litre tank and a larger 180,000 litre tank. The smaller tank feeds the house and is topped up via a float switch system so just treat the larger tank with a couple of chlorine tablets a month.
    Never had a problem in my time here. Depending on the size of tank I would simply dose it when you are leaving it for a while and all should be well when you return.
    Treat everyone as a complete and utter idiot and you can only ever be pleasantly surprised !

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    POst deleted, but I will risk going to jail for reposting this.

    Puri Tabs - Pure sell them and they are not expensive. Look out for Pura Shops แผนที่สาขาบ้านกร [at]งน้ำ


    Sorry that was so offensive mod.

  16. #16
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    Give it a heavy dose before you leave, run the taps so the dosed water gets in the pipes.
    Dose it again when you get back and run the whole tank through all your inside taps.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrAndy View Post
    cheeky bugger

    Chlorine Dioxide is sold in tablet form for small use, although quite expensive

    they are normally sold as water purification tablets for drinking water

    maybe your local water filter company or pool company could help?
    They are called Chlorine Dioxide tablets but what they are is not clear.

    As again Chlorine dioxide is a gas. Chlorine dioxide is not very nice stuff and will gas off at the slightest opportunity. It will sometimes instantaneously decompose, which is not good.

    So called chlorine dioxide tablets for water packs are more likely ASC or Acidified sodium chlorite tablets. As that is not a very catchy name they are called what they are for marketing reasons.

  18. #18
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    *** Chempro SDP***

    That should do it, remember to rinse thoroughly.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Necron99 View Post
    Give it a heavy dose before you leave, run the taps so the dosed water gets in the pipes.
    Dose it again when you get back and run the whole tank through all your inside taps.

    Actually, I recall in the olds caravan growing up they used Baby Milton on the pipes.

    Milton | Milton Sterilising Fluid

    bring a bottle with you from the UK when you come back, fill it up with the stuff in and flush it though. Clean as a babies bum and totally safe.
    Originally Posted by bsnub "No wonder I drive a tesla"

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by VocalNeal
    They are called Chlorine Dioxide tablets but what they are is not clear.
    the tablets release the Chlorine Dioxide when exposed to water

    here is one product

    Chlorine Dioxide (ClO2) Tablets - 4ppm in 30 Litres

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrAndy View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by VocalNeal
    They are called Chlorine Dioxide tablets but what they are is not clear.
    the tablets release the Chlorine Dioxide when exposed to water

    here is one product

    Chlorine Dioxide (ClO2) Tablets - 4ppm in 30 Litres
    So apart from your internet skills?

    The OP asks what he can do to treat a domestic water tank and you suggest some obscure and expensive hiking/back country water bottle purification tablets.

    Agreed I don't follow your "construction" thread posts but surely today when you had your first cup of coffee or tea or.. you forgot to take your "common sense pill"

    Using water bottle purification tablets to treat a 1000l tank would cost in the order of $0.5 to $1 a gallon or $100 to $200 a tank. Using common or garden bleach would cost about 10B and do the same job.

    Hardly practical advice?

  22. #22
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    fiar enough, that is one way

    http://www.newjerusalem.com/PureWater.htm

    and cheaper


    maybe just the chlorine tablets/powder they use to disinfect pools would be good enough

    it can be bought at any pool shop

    however, unfortunately we are talking about Legionella, and my internet skills suggest chlorination is not good enough

    Chlorination (bleach, electrolyses)
    • no sufficient disinfectant effect without simultaneous adjustment of the pH-value
    • no decomposition of the biofilm, thus no protection against re-infection
    • chlorine odour due to oxidation byproducts such as chloramine is possible


    http://www.prominent.co.uk/desktopde...149_read-2239/
    Last edited by DrAndy; 24-05-2013 at 06:15 PM.

  23. #23
    TD Fat Club VP Dillinger's Avatar
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    Walk away from the thread Andy

  24. #24
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    why? just trying to help with the best method

    chlorination is not good enough, nor is bleach (same)

  25. #25
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    ^ Maybe, but would you trust a Thai around one of your builds with a highly combustible gas ?

    I'd take the risk with the legionaires disease I reckon

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