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  1. #1
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    Greece: Shit meets Fan

    This is the end,

    and it's only the beginning for others

    Greek bonds rated 'junk' by Standard & Poor's

    look at those bargains

    Greece's 2-year government bond yield surged to almost 15% on Tuesday, making it highly expensive for the country to borrow from the debt market.

    Greek 5-year yields hit 10.6%, higher than many emerging market economies, including Ecuador at 10.5% and Ukraine at 7.1%.

    The 2-year Portuguese bond yield jumped to 5.23% from 4.16%.

  2. #2
    disturbance in the Turnip baldrick's Avatar
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    well apart from spain and portugal , france is lining up to be a contender for junk status also

    and pommyland aint that far behind.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by baldrick View Post
    well apart from spain and portugal , france is lining up to be a contender for junk status also

    and pommyland aint that far behind.
    The Eurozone is looking potentially (not quite) fucked over this one. Greece is going to stab Europe in the kidneys but the others may just chop it's balls off as they fall over.
    A hung parliament in the UK may push that over the edge as well.

    Perhaps that job I've been offered is a good idea. My UK funds won't be worth a crap at this rate.
    Be happy dudes. It's a lot more fun than crying.

  4. #4
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    The answer is to stop Moodys and the like from being allowed to rate Governments credit worthiness. Considering how they completely missed the housing crisis, rating all that junk as AAA, they should have been sued out of business anyway.

  5. #5
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    the credit agency did make mistakes, but it was part of the game, they can only make "educated" estimate, not be 100% right

    without them, it would a bigger cahos though

  6. #6
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    Plough all your money into Greek bonds at those rates, they won't default, Buddha told me.

  7. #7
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    I wait for them to yield 25% and I might

  8. #8
    disturbance in the Turnip baldrick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butterfly
    I wait for them to yield 25% and I might
    are you talking about the french govt bonds?

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    Doesn't really matter as the whole of the EU is sliding down the porcelain convenience... The PIGS nations are seeing to that... Greece is first, then Portugal, followed by Ireland and Spain... I doubt the Germans will be willing to bail out the entire EU...

  10. #10
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    Those all are massive tourist destinations . for europeans.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muadib
    Greece is first, then Portugal, followed by Ireland and Spain.
    I'm not seeing too much negative stuff about Ireland. I think the gov there have their austerity plan and are running with it.

    Perhaps you meant to put Italy instead of Ireland?

  12. #12
    Banned Muadib's Avatar
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    Italy is on the shit-list too... Last I read, Ireland is still in trouble with companies going broke and paying zero taxes to the g'ment...

    insolvencyjournal.ie > Taxing times

    Interesting chart on Greek bond yield to Euro decline against the USD...

    Give a man a match, and he'll be warm for a minute, but set him on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

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    Geman taxpayers conned into the Euro with false accounting are unsurprisingly willing to trudge to a tram through the snow to bail out those in vacation paradise
    Lower pensions benefits and longer hours and social tension will be the price,You could try and tax more but what's a Greek URN?
    Yassoo Merkel will pay the price as Sarkozy smiles

  14. #14
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    Smile

    Quote Originally Posted by Spin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Muadib
    Greece is first, then Portugal, followed by Ireland and Spain.
    I'm not seeing too much negative stuff about Ireland. I think the gov there have their austerity plan and are running with it.

    Perhaps you meant to put Italy instead of Ireland?
    Despite the utter feckless ness of my compatriots its only 1% of EU population and Biffo has reined in the worst,without the ultimate detergent exporting more Riverdancers,Italy is the rub Spain tho big has risk averse banks.
    If the Greeks drop /pushed out of the Euro may be a cheap retiremnet option once more which schadenfreude may be the hidden agenda so cold retirees can afford their place in the sun

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muadib
    Italy is on the shit-list too... Last I read,
    My bets are that Greece falls first, then Portugal, then Italy.

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    Wel Spin I was wrong Spain too on skids according to BBC 5 mins ago
    BBC News - Greece crisis: Fears grow that it could spread

  17. #17
    Banned Muadib's Avatar
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    Like dominoes falling... That swooshing sound you hear is the Euro going down the crapper...

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    Striking is a bit of a national sport in Greece. Last month, the country’s unionized prostitutes took to the streets, protesting unlicensed competition from Russian and Eastern European immigrants.

    That's it then. Those dam non-unionized hard workers from out of state are ruining the livelihood of the Greek union slackeys.

    HoweStreet.com - The Source for Market Opinions

  19. #19
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    The whole Euro concept was fatally flawed, the Meds members have a totally different outlook to life than their northern counterparts, Italy and Greece being the biggest budget fiddlers in Europe, a real disjointed family,

  20. #20
    I don't know barbaro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by baldrick View Post
    well apart from spain and portugal , france is lining up to be a contender for junk status also

    and pommyland aint that far behind.
    How will this affect the US, if it will affect the US?

    Thanks in advance.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by barbaro View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by baldrick View Post
    well apart from spain and portugal , france is lining up to be a contender for junk status also

    and pommyland aint that far behind.
    How will this affect the US, if it will affect the US?

    Thanks in advance.
    It will make it a lot cheaper for you to visit Europe and experience our superior cultures.

  22. #22
    Banned Muadib's Avatar
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    The USD will strengthen as the Euro declines... The core issue is that governments finance initiatives through bond sales and live & die by their bond ratings... As these country's ratings fall, it affects their overall ability to finance debt as the risk increases... The risk of this happening in the US declines as the risk exposure in the EU increases, however false an impression this is... $$$ will flee the Euro for a safe haven, which is still the USD...

    US markets are also reacting negatively to the PIGS situation... All markets are interconnected to a degree...

    Just my layman's perspective...

    BTW, Gold is up 7.00% in the last 2 weeks...

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by buriramboy
    It will make it a lot cheaper for you to visit Europe and experience our superior cultures.


    only if he stays out of England though

  24. #24
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    and when you thought things were sorted out for Greece, here comes this

    Greece's Costs Exceed Bailout - WSJ.com
    The bailout of Greece by euro-zone countries and the IMF won't be enough to cover the nation's costs, an examination of Greek financial figures shows.

  25. #25
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    At least three people have been killed in the Greek capital as protesters set fire to a bank during a general strike over planned austerity measures.
    The fire brigade said three bodies were found inside the bank in Athens. Another building is also on fire.
    Petrol bombs were thrown at police who responded with pepper spray, tear gas and stun grenades.
    Protesters are angered by spending cuts and tax rises planned in return for a 110bn euro (95bn) bail-out for Greece.
    Parliament is to vote on the measures by the end of the week.
    Measures include wage freezes, pension cuts and tax rises. They aim to achieve fresh budget cuts of 30bn euros over three years, with the goal of cutting Greece's public deficit to less than 3% of GDP by 2014. It currently stands at 13.6%.
    A mass rally attended by thousands of people took place in central Athens before some protests began to turn violent
    Outside parliament, a group of protesters rushed up a flight of steps, taunting MPs to come out and calling them "thieves".
    Riot police forced them back with pepper spray, tear gas and stun grenades.


    Quite simply Europe's future is at stake. Europe is at a fork in the road


    German Chancellor Angela Merkel



    Merkel urges support for Greece

    The general strike is the third to hit Greece in as many months.
    Meanwhile, the German parliament has begun considering the bail-out plan for Greece.
    Chancellor Angela Merkel urged MPs to back the emergency loan package agreed by European finance ministers at the weekend.
    It requires Germany to pay the largest proportion of the loans.
    "Quite simply, Europe's future is at stake," she said.
    The EU has agreed to provide 80bn euros (69bn) in funding - of which around 22bn euros would come from Germany - while the rest will come from the International Monetary Fund (IMF).
    Flights in and out of Greece stopped at midnight, and trains and ferries were not running. Schools, hospitals, and many offices are shut.
    'Anger mounting'
    The BBC's Malcolm Brabant in Athens says the deepening unrest will send a signal to the Greek government about the mood in the country and to the international community about Greece's problems in implementing the austerity plan.
    Tens of thousands of civil servants currently eligible for a lump sum on retirement have applied before the measures are passed, he says.
    The government has appealed to demoralised staff in the military, police, schools and hospitals not to retire, fearing the surge in demand for benefits could further drain treasury resources.

    I'm feeling more and more angry every day, because those who got us into this mess are not held responsible


    Thrasyvo Paxinos
    Teacher



    Hewitt: Europe's days of anxiety

    Foreign governments and investors are watching events in Greece with concern.
    Chris Lowe of FTN Financial in New York told the BBC that the US financial community had been shocked by the violent protests.
    "The [US] reaction is that [Greek] people will simply refuse to accept the austerity plan," he said.
    "If the Greeks are this upset, then maybe we need to worry about the Portuguese and Spanish and Italians being upset with the cuts they're going to have to make."
    Union leaders say the cuts target low-income Greeks.
    "There are other things the [government] can do, before taking money from a pensioner who earns 500 euros (430) a month," Spyros Papaspyros, leader of the public servants' union ADEDY, told Greek private television.
    #ss-rocket {width:226px;float:right;} In Athens, Greeks spoke of their anger at the tough economic measures.
    Businessman Dmitris Mentis told the BBC that wealthy Greeks had to pay their "fair share of the burden".
    "The rich class has been evading taxes for decades now," he said.
    Athens-based journalist Christos Michaelides told the BBC: "There is a big fear in the whole of society - a sense of injustice in most of the measures.
    "There is a fear that things could get very, very ugly if people don't feel that what they are doing now, in these austerity measures, is going to be worthwhile."
    On Tuesday, several thousand teachers and students marched to parliament carrying black flags and banners.

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